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exwhyzee
06-07-2013, 05:46 PM
Its a boring saturday so i browse this very forum and saw a few threads on the upcoming models like cbr250 and duke390 (to name a few) which got everyone pretty excited...and then a few of the discussions about pricing leads to comparison of our 3-tier licensing system compared to other countries where they pegged each tier to HP (horsepower) instead of CC (displacement/engine size)...so there i was wondering which of the current 2A bikes will become class 2 if our gov follows likewise...
AND being a super4 rider myself my curiosity leads me to this half-hour "RESEARCH" of the various 2A bikes that I can think of :cheeky:

CB400 52hp@11000rpm / 39Nm@9500rpm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Honda_CB400

GSR400 61hp@12000rpm / 39nm@10,000rpm
http://www.bikez.com/motorcycles/suzuki_gsr_400_2012.php

CB400F/CBR400R/400X 46hp@9500rpm / 37nm@7500rpm
http://www.motorbeam.com/bikes/honda-cbr400/honda-launches-cbr400-in-japan-announces-specifications/

DRZ400 48hp@9000rpm / 41nm@7500rpm
http://www.suzukicycles.org/DR-series/index.html?DR-Z400.shtml~isoraami

DUKE300 44hp@9500rpm / 35nm@7250rpm
http://www.wikisubmit.com/ktm-390-duke-price/

Ninja300 35hp@11000 rpm / 24nm@9750rpm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kawasaki_Ninja_300

CBR250R 24hp@9900rpm / 20nm@6750rpm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Honda_CBR250R_(2011)

These are just something that cross my curious mind and for comparison purpose only. Not saying one bike is better than the other as there are more to a bike than just horsepower. Please do not hesitate to correct me if got any of the info here wrong :cool:

Jehuty
06-07-2013, 05:59 PM
Its a boring saturday so i browse this very forum and saw a few threads on the upcoming models like cbr250 and duke390 (to name a few) which got everyone pretty excited...and then a few of the discussions about pricing leads to comparison of our 3-tier licensing system compared to other countries where they pegged each tier to HP (horsepower) instead of CC (displacement/engine size)...so there i was wondering which of the current 2A bikes will become class 2 if our gov follows likewise...
AND being a super4 rider myself my curiosity leads me to this half-hour "RESEARCH" of the various 2A bikes that I can think of :cheeky:

CB400 52hp@11000rpm / 39Nm@9500rpm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Honda_CB400

GSR400 61hp@12000rpm / 39nm@10,000rpm
http://www.bikez.com/motorcycles/suzuki_gsr_400_2012.php

CB400F/CBR400R/400X 46hp@9500rpm / 37nm@7500rpm
http://www.motorbeam.com/bikes/honda-cbr400/honda-launches-cbr400-in-japan-announces-specifications/

DRZ400 48hp@9000rpm / 41nm@7500rpm
http://www.suzukicycles.org/DR-series/index.html?DR-Z400.shtml~isoraami

DUKE300 44hp@9500rpm / 35nm@7250rpm
http://www.wikisubmit.com/ktm-390-duke-price/

Ninja300 35hp@11000 rpm / 24nm@9750rpm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kawasaki_Ninja_300

CBR250R 24hp@9900rpm / 20nm@6750rpm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Honda_CBR250R_(2011)

These are just something that cross my curious mind and for comparison purpose only. Not saying one bike is better than the other as there are more to a bike than just horsepower. Please do not hesitate to correct me if got any of the info here wrong :cool:

Well my CB400 is supposed to be 52 but it feels like 40. ZXR400s and 250 2 strokes can make more than 60 tho, hitting close to 70 modded.

Putting price to HP figures is dumb, you'll have to dyno every bike then, besides power isn't everything.

r1der
06-07-2013, 08:27 PM
2a bike is mainly for practical usage n its horsepower is more than enuf in spore. but if u really wan to go for performance n high horsepower, u should go for class 2 bike.

anyway. super4 is the popular king of class 2a bike in spore... so, definitely no regret if go for super4. :angel:

102611M
28-07-2013, 05:08 PM
At the end of the day all these specs about horsepower, price, top speed, bla bla bla is subjective. Honestly i feel that my Ninja 250 is enough for me as it hit 120km/h easily but others may find my bike slow, sluggish, small etc.

And yeah i do agree with r1der, if speed is your thing then might as well go for a class 2. And many thanks for the TS too for the comparison!

wathell
28-07-2013, 08:06 PM
Great thread!

Thanks for the hard work in compiling this list. I'm sure some people might find this information useful in getting their next ride :thumb:

TheSquid
29-07-2013, 10:44 AM
older gen bikes stock spec from what I know.

CBR NC23 - 59bhp
CBR NC29 - 56bhp
VFR NC30 - 60bhp
RVF NC35 - 59bhp
GSXR400 - 59bhp
ZXR400 - 62bhp

motordude
29-07-2013, 12:43 PM
Guys, correct me if I am wrong. poor understanding of horsepower and torque.please enlighten me

Am I to say that if you are heavy weight and always carrying pillion, a bike with more torque like the drz would be the ideal choice
and if you are one who always like to speed here and there, you should take a bike with high horsepower like the GSR400?





Its a boring saturday so i browse this very forum and saw a few threads on the upcoming models like cbr250 and duke390 (to name a few) which got everyone pretty excited...and then a few of the discussions about pricing leads to comparison of our 3-tier licensing system compared to other countries where they pegged each tier to HP (horsepower) instead of CC (displacement/engine size)...so there i was wondering which of the current 2A bikes will become class 2 if our gov follows likewise...
AND being a super4 rider myself my curiosity leads me to this half-hour "RESEARCH" of the various 2A bikes that I can think of :cheeky:

CB400 52hp@11000rpm / 39Nm@9500rpm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Honda_CB400

GSR400 61hp@12000rpm / 39nm@10,000rpm
http://www.bikez.com/motorcycles/suzuki_gsr_400_2012.php

CB400F/CBR400R/400X 46hp@9500rpm / 37nm@7500rpm
http://www.motorbeam.com/bikes/honda-cbr400/honda-launches-cbr400-in-japan-announces-specifications/

DRZ400 48hp@9000rpm / 41nm@7500rpm
http://www.suzukicycles.org/DR-series/index.html?DR-Z400.shtml~isoraami

DUKE300 44hp@9500rpm / 35nm@7250rpm
http://www.wikisubmit.com/ktm-390-duke-price/

Ninja300 35hp@11000 rpm / 24nm@9750rpm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kawasaki_Ninja_300

CBR250R 24hp@9900rpm / 20nm@6750rpm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Honda_CBR250R_(2011)

These are just something that cross my curious mind and for comparison purpose only. Not saying one bike is better than the other as there are more to a bike than just horsepower. Please do not hesitate to correct me if got any of the info here wrong :cool:

SlowButSteady Bro
31-07-2013, 11:59 PM
There are diff purpose of set up,Example Drz400 its only a single cylinder but good in acceleration after that its just shitty on highways.City riding two cylinders is great as their low and mid range torque is ready but sacrifice on top end.4 cylinders power delivery always come from mid and top..I would prefer if yamaha come out with FZ4 3 cylinders or Triumph with speed triple 400

motordude
01-08-2013, 02:51 AM
There are diff purpose of set up,Example Drz400 its only a single cylinder but good in acceleration after that its just shitty on highways.City riding two cylinders is great as their low and mid range torque is ready but sacrifice on top end.4 cylinders power delivery always come from mid and top..I would prefer if yamaha come out with FZ4 3 cylinders or Triumph with speed triple 400

Sorry bro, when you refer to low mid and top. it is the rpm right not the speed?

Jehuty
01-08-2013, 07:44 AM
Guys, correct me if I am wrong. poor understanding of horsepower and torque.please enlighten me

Am I to say that if you are heavy weight and always carrying pillion, a bike with more torque like the drz would be the ideal choice
and if you are one who always like to speed here and there, you should take a bike with high horsepower like the GSR400?

I see big people pillioning big pillion riding kups with no problem. You want speed, class 2 lor, you want agility for city riding, get a scoot, kup or motard.

A DRZ would have acceleration but no top end.
A GSR would have top end but not as quick and nimble as the DRZ.

If you're riding just in Singapore, DRZs and kups fill in nicely, if you're going thru Msia and a lil touring, GSR

SlowButSteady Bro
06-08-2013, 09:28 AM
All depends,Some high horsepower/Torque but only arrive after certain rpms.
Some low but arrive as early rpms.Weight also play a part,Some 100hp/100nm but weight 170kg while other only 80hp/90nm but weight less than 150kg...

CSV
06-08-2013, 01:33 PM
horsepower is not everything.......must take into account, torque, wet weight etc.

CSV
06-08-2013, 01:34 PM
horsepower is not everything.......must take into account, torque, wet weight etc.

revhappy
06-08-2013, 03:36 PM
...If you're riding just in Singapore, DRZs and kups fill in nicely....

Why you leave out naked bikes? For me a naked 2B bike like Pulsar, FZ16, CBF150 and YBR is much better than a kup like Spark or Wave considering the price difference is not that much. Its much more stable on the roads, feels better to ride and looks better too.

donhxw
07-08-2013, 11:25 PM
CB400[/B] 52hp@11000rpm / 39Nm@9500rpm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Honda_CB400

GSR400 61hp@12000rpm / 39nm@10,000rpm
http://www.bikez.com/motorcycles/suzuki_gsr_400_2012.php

CB400F/CBR400R/400X 46hp@9500rpm / 37nm@7500rpm
http://www.motorbeam.com/bikes/honda-cbr400/honda-launches-cbr400-in-japan-announces-specifications/

DRZ400 48hp@9000rpm / 41nm@7500rpm
http://www.suzukicycles.org/DR-series/index.html?DR-Z400.shtml~isoraami

DUKE300 44hp@9500rpm / 35nm@7250rpm
http://www.wikisubmit.com/ktm-390-duke-price/

Ninja300 35hp@11000 rpm / 24nm@9750rpm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kawasaki_Ninja_300

CBR250R 24hp@9900rpm / 20nm@6750rpm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Honda_CBR250R_(2011)

These are just something that cross my curious mind and for comparison purpose only. Not saying one bike is better than the other as there are more to a bike than just horsepower. Please do not hesitate to correct me if got any of the info here wrong :cool:

Ninja 300 should be 39bhp,
TS if got time try to research wet weight too as it really plays a huge role in end performance result... also dont forget the ninja 400, the new one which excel cycle PIs... no agent bike... only 1 sold in 2012 but recently excel cycle brought in 6 more units for sale... similar in styling to the new cbr 400

SlowButSteady Bro
08-08-2013, 07:10 PM
Ninja 300 should be 39bhp,
TS if got time try to research wet weight too as it really plays a huge role in end performance result... also dont forget the ninja 400, the new one which excel cycle PIs... no agent bike... only 1 sold in 2012 but recently excel cycle brought in 6 more units for sale... similar in styling to the new cbr 400

Hmm ya another 1,Look exactly like its brother ER650.Awesome but its wet weight of nearly 199kg put me off.The new CB400 series is great for Singapore roads in my honest opinion.Dont need high rev to get better acceleration cause the low end torque is superb than Inline 4 400cc

Baal
28-08-2013, 06:10 PM
..I would prefer if yamaha come out with FZ4 3 cylinders or Triumph with speed triple 400[/QUOTE]

that may take a while since this triple thing is so new for yammy. Their MT09 seems to fit in between the 675 triple for supersports & their lobbying for 1100 for superbike triple rules. Hence, I infer that they are testing water with this MT09 for the coming supersports & world superbike line up.

What may be more easily done will be to reduce the bore of their XJ6 to 400cc. And have another 400cc inline 4 contender.

eg

r1...detune....Fazer 1 reduce bore Fazer 8.

r6 detune Fazer 6/XJ6 reduce bore XJ4/Fazer 4

Else Honda seems to have the monopoly. While Suzook has GSR400, its priced more like a 600cc.

angdao
23-10-2013, 12:44 AM
weight over power ratio?

Baal
23-10-2013, 02:24 PM
Good question. haven quite calculated for each bike. For S4 & GSR4 should be similar . 1 is 53ps/193kg Vs 61ps/210kg. Could be the KTM 390 at 44/140kg ?

CoolieND
29-10-2013, 01:06 AM
Ducati Monster 400 efi: 44bhp @ 11,000rpm, 31Nm @ 9,500
Ducati Monster 400 (older): 44.1 bhp @ 10500 rpm, 34.3 Nm @ 8750 rpm.

Baal
05-11-2013, 10:16 PM
Based on above, I would think the monster 400 is more like the new Honda 400 f/r/x. Be it Hp or power to weight.

I would guess under 2A, power to weight ratio winner is Duke 375. 44hp/149kg ( incl full petrol ).
Based on pure HP, winner is GSR4 at 60hp. (09 model onwards)

CoolieND
07-11-2013, 11:23 PM
The Monster 400ei (EFI, ~2004-2006), but weight ex fuel is 168kg. Lighter than the Hondas, listed at 190-ish (can't tell if that's dry or wet).

From what I've read, the Monster 400 uses roughly the same engine as the 400SS, with only minor upgrades (EFI especially)... worked fine, but sure it could put out a few more bhp w new tech.

The KTM's thumper puts out roughly the same power, but is it mostly only low-end grunt? The L-twin's got great mid-range power.

I wouldn't mind trying out a Duke 390, tho, if given an opportunity. ;)
Can't say anything against the GSR-400 tho, that thing is a beast. 61hp? A GSX-R400 in sheep's clothing...

Baal
08-11-2013, 08:58 AM
The 190ish is wet weight. Honda Jpn cant tell much. But when go to UK/USA sites & magazine, they report the same 190ish as kerb/wet weight. Back in 1999 when I visited minerva, boss himself also told me that for twin cylinder , 400cc a little underpowered. So the M400 has similar torque / hp, wet/kerb weight to the new 400 series Hondas. ( I understand that up to early -mid 2000s, Ducatis list their hp based on rear wheel. In this case, M400 had 40hp which will be same as these Hondas at the rear wheel)

CoolieND
08-11-2013, 11:53 PM
Yes, 44hp is @ crankshaft, aren't all numbers here the same? Again, the M400 engine appears to be just tweaked over a span of 20 years. (Wish they'd design a new one.)

The Monster 400cc may be 'underpowered', given its 620 frame, but it's enough. :)

On the weight, M400 would be 168 + 11 = 179kg full tank, so still 11-15kg off the CB400 family (by the stats sheets , depending on model / ABS).

Baal
11-11-2013, 10:15 AM
but need to add another 3 litres of EO. No coolant since air cooled.

CoolieND
12-11-2013, 02:26 PM
168kg includes Engine Oil, battery, brake fluid, etc. The specific term Ducati used was "Dry weight in running order without fuel".

To indicate a true "Dry weight" they will use "In running order without fluids and battery".