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Thread: Sian!! Higher prices for big bikes

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    kotek69
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    Thumbs down Sian!! Higher prices for big bikes



    Nasty surprise for all Class 2A and Class 2 riders from budget day today:

    http://carbuyer.com.sg/index.php/new...arf-diesel-tax

    Sianz...

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    Increase in ARF but motorcycle de-registration value still zero $$??

     

     
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    The motorcycle population has been slowly decreasing as very few Open category COEs have been used to register them.
    Oh there are people who use open cat to register for motorcycles????

    Mr Heng explained that a small but rising number of buyers are buying expensive motorcycles, with OMVs similar to those of small cars.
    To address this, the tiered ARF will be introduced for motorcycles registered with COEs obtained from the second February bidding exercise onwards.
    Is expensive already still make it more expensive???
    I cannot understand the rationale of this statement...After he got stroke, he cannot think properly???
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    i seriously cannot comprehend why target the minority of bike enthusiast who willing to spend their hard earned $ on something they love. Its not like we use it as our daily commute and hog the roads. Seriously .. show us stats the prove the need to come out with this silly initiative.



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    Quote Originally Posted by KILROY68 View Post
    i seriously cannot comprehend why target the minority of bike enthusiast who willing to spend their hard earned $ on something they love. Its not like we use it as our daily commute and hog the roads. Seriously .. show us stats the prove the need to come out with this silly initiative.
    it's a luxury tax... similar to cars. to differentiate bread n butter models and luxury ones
    Liverpool revival has started....

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    Quote Originally Posted by kzone View Post
    it's a luxury tax... similar to cars. to differentiate bread n butter models and luxury ones
    Yes, I agree to this statement.
    I believe is good ONLY IF this can help to lower down the current COE prices

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    Quote Originally Posted by kawarides View Post
    Yes, I agree to this statement.
    I believe is good ONLY IF this can help to lower down the current COE prices
    I don't think COE for bikes will go down as the demand for bikes will be there as long as car prices remain unaffordable. I rather ppl buy a luxury bike then a small car as it takes up lesser space on the road.
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    Default Sian!! Higher prices for big bikes

    Quote Originally Posted by hachi View Post
    The motorcycle population has been slowly decreasing as very few Open category COEs have been used to register them.
    Oh there are people who use open cat to register for motorcycles????

    Mr Heng explained that a small but rising number of buyers are buying expensive motorcycles, with OMVs similar to those of small cars.
    To address this, the tiered ARF will be introduced for motorcycles registered with COEs obtained from the second February bidding exercise onwards.
    Is expensive already still make it more expensive???
    I cannot understand the rationale of this statement...After he got stroke, he cannot think properly???
    Not he can't think, he is not a rider.
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    Quote Originally Posted by kawarides View Post
    Yes, I agree to this statement.
    I believe is good ONLY IF this can help to lower down the current COE prices
    COE will definitely go down but not to the level u want. in any case, it's the demand that fuel COE price increases. And it's not uncommon to see bikers owning more than 1 bike... even 3 or 4. with this recent changes, we might see less in future.
    Liverpool revival has started....

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    double post

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    they are not helping us with the incessant number of pollution created by malaysia riders, their parking as you like as if they are in malaysia, their incredible riding skills, their taking away singapore riders job for delivery etec, etc etc. and this is how they collect their fund?? economy is bad for citizen, i think its the same for the garment.

    "they" say bmw1200 is luxury and thus arf mus t rise. when will this stop???. later in future, their excuse will be honda wave also is a luxury as the demand is more for wave and thus arf will increase 200% sheeeshhhhhhh

    many of my friend kena stroke but no bleed in the brain and thus need not operate. but this heng ah really heng. kena stroke, operate and walau, a few months later can come out with this incredible idea

     

     
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    Yahmarhuh
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    will we see 2nd hand bike sellers increasing their prices now?

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    I would expect 2nd prices to go up. If a new Harley is now going to be $60k, it wouldn't make sense for a seller to list a second hand one at current rates (around $20k'ish).

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    crazytown
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    It is certainly something to consider raising the price of a second hand bike now it is going to put so much on top of the price of a new bike.
    I was considering going for a new MT-10 at some point, now will stay with my MT-09.
    No interest in paying tax for the sake of paying tax.

    Below taken from LTA website.

    Example:
    The ARF payable for a motorcycle/ scooter with an OMV of S$12,000 will be calculated as follows:

    Vehicle OMV
    (S$12,000) ARF Rate ARF Payable
    First S$5,000 15% 15% x S$5,000 = S$750
    Next S$5,000 50% 50% x S$5,000 = S$2,500
    Above S$10,000 100% 100% x S$2,000 = S$2,000

    Total ARF payable is (S$750 + S$2,500 + S$2,000) = S$5,250
    Forever the Foreigner

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    kotek69
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    Quote Originally Posted by TwoWheelsOnly View Post
    Increase in ARF but motorcycle de-registration value still zero $$??
    That is actually an excellent point

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    Quote Originally Posted by buttbutt8 View Post
    Not he can't think, he is not a rider.

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    Quote Originally Posted by crazytown View Post
    It is certainly something to consider raising the price of a second hand bike now it is going to put so much on top of the price of a new bike.
    I was considering going for a new MT-10 at some point, now will stay with my MT-09.
    No interest in paying tax for the sake of paying tax.

    Below taken from LTA website.

    Example:
    The ARF payable for a motorcycle/ scooter with an OMV of S$12,000 will be calculated as follows:

    Vehicle OMV
    (S$12,000) ARF Rate ARF Payable
    First S$5,000 15% 15% x S$5,000 = S$750
    Next S$5,000 50% 50% x S$5,000 = S$2,500
    Above S$10,000 100% 100% x S$2,000 = S$2,000

    Total ARF payable is (S$750 + S$2,500 + S$2,000) = S$5,250
    Extra 4.5k from 1 bike only....that's some good LTA scholar critical thinking.

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    Really bad timing. I just got my 2A and this happened......

    Was thinking of getting my class 2 and get a Harley Davidson before I turn 40, looks like it going to be kicked further down.

    My thinking is that COE will come down to 3.5K to 4K prices since the quota will increase by quite a fair bit. This will benefit the majority or about half the biker community with smaller capacity engines. The food companies will rejoice since their cost for delivery will come down.

    Those who agree that it is a luxury tax which mirrors the car's back in 2013, it is rightly as so. As our Mr Heng puts it, high end bikes OMV are about the same as those of cars, it will be seen as a 'small car'. If you look at it this way, those with the money to buy a small car opted to buy a high end bike will pay similar prices.

    The argument we cannot swallow is the space and capacity that a car take up is so much more than a large bike. So why are we paying that kind of rate.

    A Harley Road King will cost about $60K-$70K now with the adjusted rate. 2nd hand ones will be jacked up as well.

    The Softail Slim S which I am eyeing for will cost about $50K to $60K now from $45K in the showroom last month. I am lost for words ... ....

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    For a bike with OMV of $28,000

    ARF is up from $4,200 to $21,250


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    Quote Originally Posted by SoftailSlimS View Post
    Those who agree that it is a luxury tax which mirrors the car's back in 2013, it is rightly as so. As our Mr Heng puts it, high end bikes OMV are about the same as those of cars, it will be seen as a 'small car'. If you look at it this way, those with the money to buy a small car opted to buy a high end bike will pay similar prices.

    The argument we cannot swallow is the space and capacity that a car take up is so much more than a large bike. So why are we paying that kind of rate.
    I think what is going to make it even harder to swallow, and give you an indication that this is nothing more than a government mandated mafia style shake down scam, is that motorcycles are still not eligible for rebates when they deregister before 10 years even after the ARF increase, while cars have had it all the while.
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    Quote Originally Posted by reize View Post
    I think what is going to make it even harder to swallow, and give you an indication that this is nothing more than a government mandated mafia style shake down scam, is that motorcycles are still not eligible for rebates when they deregister before 10 years even after the ARF increase, while cars have had it all the while.
    This they act blur first until someone make noise

     

     
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    So 2nd hand market for class 2 bikes. Will be more popular


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    2nd hand market will get a boost... I see many good bikes for sale but people prefer to buy new especially for big bikes despite the high COE prices. hopefully with will create a more vibrant 2nd hand market and force dealers to lower their margins on new bikes to be more attractive.
    Liverpool revival has started....

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    Quote Originally Posted by mrfr0sty View Post
    For a bike with OMV of $28,000

    ARF is up from $4,200 to $21,250

    Which bike has an OMV of $28K???

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    Quote Originally Posted by journey View Post
    Which bike has an OMV of $28K???
    Goldwings?
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    kawasaki ninja h2, many ducati and bmw , bimota, victory , HD,can am, mv agusta, moto guzzi, indian . my guess only because i cant never buy all these bikes ever

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    will be good if can get a hold of a list of bikes with their OMV. From what I know, not many bike OMV are above 20K even among the Ducati, BMW & Harley Davidson

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    Quote Originally Posted by yahmarhuh View Post
    will be good if can get a hold of a list of bikes with their omv. From what i know, not many bike omv are above 20k even among the ducati, bmw & harley davidson
    bmw gsa omv 22,804.00

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    Quote Originally Posted by smallcar View Post
    bmw gsa omv 22,804.00
    that's the 1200 GSA... essentially top of the line stuffs.

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    Quote Originally Posted by yahmarhuh View Post
    that's the 1200 gsa... Essentially top of the line stuffs.
    bmw k1600 gtl 28,325.00.

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    Quote Originally Posted by smallcar View Post
    bmw k1600 gtl 28,325.00.
    When luxury is freed of all ballast, it moves to a new level. At the very top of this evolution is the new K 1600 GTL – a high-class touring bike like none before it.....

    http://www.bmwmotorcycles.com/us/en/..._overview.html

     

     
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yahmarhuh View Post
    When luxury is freed of all ballast, it moves to a new level. At the very top of this evolution is the new K 1600 GTL – a high-class touring bike like none before it.....

    http://www.bmwmotorcycles.com/us/en/..._overview.html
    cannot afford liao. With this new ****, expect over 75K to 80K for the new K

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    i hope my dream comes true. in singapore, we actually dont need high powered, big cc bikes. just your average 600cc to 800c is suffice. even going malaysia, we cant really speed. 110km/hr. if bm, hd , and all the bikes companies want their singapore market, they should downsize their bikes. make a mini version of the GSA. 800cc using the same engine for their 800cc bikes BUT with the same shape and shaft drive but of course slightly lower and lighter.
    honda also can follow suit. making a bronzewing ---- exactly like their goldwing but 750cc to 800cc with shaft drive. it has been done before in the 80s and 70s
    anyway, just a dream because YOU KNOW WHO will wake me up from that dream because they will say, oh no because now you order so many of these 700cc bikes, it has now become a luxury item and many people are bidding for the coe. and guess what . we will introduce a PARF like cars.

    so its a vicious cycle until something snaps

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    I don't know much about bikes... but don't most brand offers a lower cc version for each models? Of cos not at the same exact specs but a little less features, lower specs. Eg for BMW, many models under touring, sport etc. Ducati also have many CC of their monsters

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    Quote Originally Posted by MR BIKER View Post
    i hope my dream comes true. in singapore, we actually dont need high powered, big cc bikes. just your average 600cc to 800c is suffice. even going malaysia, we cant really speed. 110km/hr. if bm, hd , and all the bikes companies want their singapore market, they should downsize their bikes. make a mini version of the GSA. 800cc using the same engine for their 800cc bikes BUT with the same shape and shaft drive but of course slightly lower and lighter.
    honda also can follow suit. making a bronzewing ---- exactly like their goldwing but 750cc to 800cc with shaft drive. it has been done before in the 80s and 70s
    anyway, just a dream because YOU KNOW WHO will wake me up from that dream because they will say, oh no because now you order so many of these 700cc bikes, it has now become a luxury item and many people are bidding for the coe. and guess what . we will introduce a PARF like cars.

    so its a vicious cycle until something snaps
    Its not going to happen. Singapore market too small for the big bike brand to start design n have a production line. They also know one new rules out from ( U know who ). They can kiss their R&D money good bye. Only one word in sin. Buy or cannot afford to own one.

    U can see cam am brand. New model 3 wheeler over weight and cannot come into Singapore. They dun even bother with Singapore as volume too small
    Last edited by smallcar; 22-02-2017 at 05:41 PM. Reason: add more content

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    Quote Originally Posted by smallcar View Post
    Its not going to happen. Singapore market too small for the big bike brand to start design n have a production line. They also know one new rules out from ( U know who ). They can kiss their R&D money good bye. Only one word in sin. Buy or cannot afford to own one.

    U can see cam am brand. New model 3 wheeler over weight and cannot come into Singapore. They dun even bother with Singapore as volume too small


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    Quote Originally Posted by Ruusty View Post


    Great speech from zehzeh



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    hopefully this new ARF will minimise such ppl who takes up 2 or more COEs so that the additiomal COEs can go to common ppl.

    curious... IF COE goes down to about 4K, which means bikes with OMV below 5K will now cost about 2.5k lesser... helping those with lesser income to buy new bikes and to reduce the cost of COE renewal, do you feel that its a successful policy change? would you be happy?
    Last edited by Yahmarhuh; 23-02-2017 at 09:07 AM.

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    There is no guarantee COE will even go down. They may have stopped the bleeding effect to Open CAT, but they can just as easily stop adding to the total figure, so every bidding cycle the only pool available are those recycled from deregistered bikes.
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  39. #39
    Yahmarhuh
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    Quote Originally Posted by reize View Post
    There is no guarantee COE will even go down. They may have stopped the bleeding effect to Open CAT, but they can just as easily stop adding to the total figure, so every bidding cycle the only pool available are those recycled from deregistered bikes.
    we will know tomorrow... dats y I'm asking for opinions IF COE goes down to 4K level, how would u guys feel?

    I', sure most ppl who buys 2B bread & butter bikes will be happy... but those who buy hobby bikes who are the majority of the forummers here will still be affected negatively. I personally am ok to pay more for luxury items if it helps the common folks to make end meets.

  40. #40
    wait4me
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    those who continue bread and butter 2b bikes will be happy at the moment
    but those who wanna buy additional bikes or upgrade the bikes will face the toughest test
    一路向北 4 EVER , my friend



  41. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yahmarhuh View Post
    will be good if can get a hold of a list of bikes with their OMV. From what I know, not many bike OMV are above 20K even among the Ducati, BMW & Harley Davidson
    many angmo brand bikes OMV is over 20k.
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  42. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yahmarhuh View Post
    curious... IF COE goes down to about 4K, which means bikes with OMV below 5K will now cost about 2.5k lesser... helping those with lesser income to buy new bikes and to reduce the cost of COE renewal, do you feel that its a successful policy change? would you be happy?
    More chance of snow falling on top of Marina Bay Sands while Elvis Presley sings Blue Suede Shoes


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    Quote Originally Posted by HairyDragon View Post
    More chance of snow falling on top of Marina Bay Sands while Elvis Presley sings Blue Suede Shoes


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    never know my friends
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    Just checked on SGBIKEMART and 2nd hand bike prices have jumped sky high


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    Quote Originally Posted by HairyDragon View Post
    Just checked on SGBIKEMART and 2nd hand bike prices have jumped sky high


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    if they have been unsold before the price hike, no reason for it to be sold now.

  46. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by HairyDragon View Post
    More chance of snow falling on top of Marina Bay Sands while Elvis Presley sings Blue Suede Shoes


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    u mean all the new bike buyers wont be affected by the new ARF and will still continue their planned purchases? So the increase is no big deal?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ruusty View Post


    Great speech from zehzeh



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    Y is it great when such multiple bike owners are part of the cause of high COEs? They hog more than 1 COE while our low income fellow riders who needs a bike for basic needs to fight with them for that elusive COE.

    The increased ARF is supposed to deter multiple bike owners and also those who buy bike for the occasional casual rides.
    Liverpool revival has started....

  48. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by kzone View Post
    Y is it great when such multiple bike owners are part of the cause of high COEs? They hog more than 1 COE while our low income fellow riders who needs a bike for basic needs to fight with them for that elusive COE.

    The increased ARF is supposed to deter multiple bike owners and also those who buy bike for the occasional casual rides.
    ARF isn't going to deter multiple bike owners. It's there to deter people buying luxury bikes.

    Those who buy 10 under $5000 OMV bikes not affected by the new ARF, but will still fight with you for COE. But those who are content to have just one and only one expensive BMW or Harley or Ducati are punished, even though they are not vying with you for extra COE.

    Logic leh.
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    Quote Originally Posted by reize View Post
    ARF isn't going to deter multiple bike owners. It's there to deter people buying luxury bikes.

    Those who buy 10 under $5000 OMV bikes not affected by the new ARF, but will still fight with you for COE. But those who are content to have just one and only one expensive BMW or Harley or Ducati are punished, even though they are not vying with you for extra COE.

    Logic leh.
    bro... u go see those with multiple bikes.... do they own multiple under $5000 OMV bikes or do they generally own higher OMV bikes as u say "expensive BMW or Harley or Ducati "

    You need to realise that this is a luxury tax, similar to the tiered ARF for cars introduced in 2013. I don't like this change as I ride as a an interest rather than a need.

    But u cant deny that people like me and probably most in this forums are the ones who can do without a bike. We are the ones who don't need the bike COE but still have 1 or more because we like to and can. This has cause the demand for COE to rise and affect those who really need a bike.

    Having said that, I don't agree with the number of bike COEs being released now. It should be much higher because we have minimal impact on the road congestion but that is a separate discussion altogether.
    Liverpool revival has started....

  50. #50
    MR BIKER
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    if this future bike ever comes to singapore, I am sure garment will rubbing their hands with glee. imagine the price alone is US$160000. https://futurism.com/4-this-is-the-s...actually-ride/

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