Woopa!! Cbr1000rr Riders

[DenverDino]

You're still doing it wrong, LOL.

 

This is how I do it, start engine, sit on bike so it is upright, after a min, stop engine, take out dip stick while you're seated & bike is upright, wipe clean with tissue, put it back but don't screw in ... 3 mins after the engine has stopped, pull out dip stick and check level.

 

Now, go check and let us know if you're losing oil.

 

Tashi, correct me if im wrong on this. I tot we need a cool engine to read our engine oil level??? If let say the engine is warm/heat up or the bike has already started then the level will never get the correct reading cause the oil already running all over the engine. The reason we need cool engine without any starting ur bike to test it becos the oil will stay at the lowest part. The best is do the test on morning before u start your engine then u will get the correct one.

[DenverDino]

Hey! Wait a minute....That was what I did dude.

 

LOL! I sound like a problem kid on the CBR forum.... problem after problem.

 

Honda made the bike so good but failed to put a glass window to check the engine oil level.

 

Bro, dont say like that...we are sharing the problems here mah. Who know anyone here also kana leh??? I also got problem on RR8 for the first 2 mth...then all the problem i post here to inform everyone to take note. WE SHARE THE KNOWLEDGE...............

[mx_catfish]

Tashi, correct me if im wrong on this. I tot we need a cool engine to read our engine oil level??? If let say the engine is warm/heat up or the bike has already started then the level will never get the correct reading cause the oil already running all over the engine. The reason we need cool engine without any starting ur bike to test it becos the oil will stay at the lowest part. The best is do the test on morning before u start your engine then u will get the correct one.

 

Tashi's actually right. It's in the Owners manual. I was puzzled too as in why the engine has to be started and idled for 3 mins...LOL???

[mx_catfish]

Bro, dont say like that...we are sharing the problems here mah. Who know anyone here also kana leh??? I also got problem on RR8 for the first 2 mth...then all the problem i post here to inform everyone to take note. WE SHARE THE KNOWLEDGE...............

 

I understand. It's all cool.

 

Sorry I emo-ed a little back there...LOL!

New bike so abit paranoid about every little glitches.

...and some not so constructive comments by others when I posted those problems.

 

Thanks.

[mx_catfish]

Will not have any negative effect. Anyway, it a very simple process and is reversable easily.

 

Care to share how it's done?

[mx_catfish]

For the makan engine oil issue...so far in this thread got how many ppl kana. I think i need to check mine liao. Is it very serious????

 

I just went for an oil change to confirm...oil that was drained was less than 2 litres of oil...please go check.

[RoslanSp]

For the makan engine oil issue...so far in this thread got how many ppl kana. I think i need to check mine liao. Is it very serious????

 

This is serius issue.. i must go n check my rr8..

 

What is the capacity of the engine oil? (with n without oil filter change)

[RoslanSp]

Care to share how it's done?

 

PM sent...

[mx_catfish]

This is serius issue.. i must go n check my rr8..

 

What is the capacity of the engine oil? (with n without oil filter change)

 

Recommended capacity is approximately 3 litres with oil filter change.( In the owner's manual )

It is not mentioned how much without the oil filter change, so my guess is just 3 litres is sufficient with or without the change of oil filter.

[Tashi]

Tashi, correct me if im wrong on this. I tot we need a cool engine to read our engine oil level??? If let say the engine is warm/heat up or the bike has already started then the level will never get the correct reading cause the oil already running all over the engine. The reason we need cool engine without any starting ur bike to test it becos the oil will stay at the lowest part. The best is do the test on morning before u start your engine then u will get the correct one.

 

Dino, you are not wrong, it depends on what you are riding/driving. Some vehicles, you have to check the oil level when the oil has drained back to the sump, like in the morning or after a long while after you have started the engine, it depends on how the engine is designed I guess.

[Tashi]

well, so far maxima extra on my blade was doing well.... smooth acceleration

 

My butt is very sensitive, even using a different brand of petrol from the one I normally use, I can feel the roughness in the engine.

 

But honestly, I have not tried Extra on the RR8, maybe due to past experience, I've totally no interest in trying it again.

[Tashi]

Hi guys..

 

Do you have any idea if the we mod the flapper valve in the stock pipe?

I heard the sound n power was great. But not sure if there is negative effects... hmmm...

 

I posted a very good article on exhaust flow on this thread previously, if you can find it and understand that article, you will be convinced not to do that mod.

[Tashi]

I just went for an oil change to confirm...oil that was drained was less than 2 litres of oil...please go check.

 

I am tempted to personally check the engine oil level for you. When you've piled on about 1,000km, and if you're on, we can meet in SG for minum/makan, then I can check for you.

[Tashi]

I kept within 5000rpm only for the 1st 1000km...then go track liao...Honda's book says 500km.

 

Maybe that's your problem. Why did you keep to 5000rpm only?

 

Possibly you did not load the engine enough, without the pressure to push the pistons against the cylinder walls, the seal was less than perfect, resulting in a leaky engine.

 

The last time someone I know ran in his bike in super low rev mode, excessive blow-by pressurized the crankcase so much, oil was forced back up past the pistons, out the air intake valves, and the air filter was covered with oil. I dunno if that's possible, at least that is what I think happened. Haha, don't mean to scare you ya.

Edited March 7, 2009 by Tashi

[kinwei]

I just went for an oil change to confirm...oil that was drained was less than 2 litres of oil...please go check.

 

For this one, normally the oil drained out will be much lesser then what you've pour in. Even for my 600 and 750. I did all the oil change myself, so I know how much oil was drained out. Don't ask me why thou. To me, as long the oil level signal is not out, there is no big alarm for it.

[kinwei]

Care to share how it's done?

 

You can refer to this Youtube video,

on how it is done.

[kinwei]

I posted a very good article on exhaust flow on this thread previously, if you can find it and understand that article, you will be convinced not to do that mod.

 

Possible to dig out the write up? Can't find it. Thanks.

 

However if you were to change to a aftermarket exhaust, all valves will automatically go with the stock exhaust. As long it is not over lean, it should be okay. I supposed that what the close loop O2 sensor is there for.

[mx_catfish]

For this one, normally the oil drained out will be much lesser then what you've pour in. Even for my 600 and 750. I did all the oil change myself, so I know how much oil was drained out. Don't ask me why thou. To me, as long the oil level signal is not out, there is no big alarm for it.

 

Thanks. Gee...1 litre difference is quite alot though.

[kinwei]

I found this write up on the net which is almost to which is quite close to what my thought on the engine thingy. Write up

[Tashi]

Possible to dig out the write up? Can't find it. Thanks.

 

However if you were to change to a aftermarket exhaust, all valves will automatically go with the stock exhaust. As long it is not over lean, it should be okay. I supposed that what the close loop O2 sensor is there for.

 

Ok, found it. The 2nd valve is to balance the flow capacity with velocity. After market pipes supposed to have done some R&D, and they would have balanced the flow capacity with velocity. However, if you look at the stock and after market power graphs, the after market curve usually dips below the stock pipe at lower RPMs.

 

V12Merlin here used to work for BS, and the Honda Japan mechs told him the same thing about the exhaust valve, it is there to give you more power at the lower end.

 

So when a local mech who can't properly complete a sentence without half filling it with vulgarities tell me, "knn, take out ah, take out aleady cb power ah", I'll always give them this look.

 

 

I. Introduction

One of the most misunderstood concepts in exhaust theory is backpressure. People love to talk about backpressure on message boards with no real understanding of what it is and what it's consequences are. I'm sure many of you have heard or read the phrase "Engines need backpressure" when discussing exhaust upgrades. That phrase is in fact completely inaccurate and a wholly misguided notion.

 

II. Some basic exhaust theory

Your exhaust system is designed to evacuate gases from the combustion chamber quickly and efficently. Exhaust gases are not produced in a smooth stream; exhaust gases originate in pulses. A 4 cylinder motor will have 4 distinct pulses per complete engine cycle, a 6 cylinder has 6 pules and so on. The more pulses that are produced, the more continuous the exhaust flow. Backpressure can be loosely defined as the resistance to positive flow - in this case, the resistance to positive flow of the exhaust stream.

 

III. Backpressure and velocity

Some people operate under the misguided notion that wider pipes are more effective at clearing the combustion chamber than narrower pipes. It's not hard to see how this misconception is appealing - wider pipes have the capability to flow more than narrower pipes. So if they have the ability to flow more, why isn't "wider is better" a good rule of thumb for exhaust upgrading? In a word - VELOCITY. I'm sure that all of you have at one time used a garden hose w/o a spray nozzle on it. If you let the water just run unrestricted out of the house it flows at a rather slow rate. However, if you take your finger and cover part of the opening, the water will flow out at a much much faster rate.

 

The astute exhaust designer knows that you must balance flow capacity with velocity. You want the exhaust gases to exit the chamber and speed along at the highest velocity possible - you want a FAST exhaust stream. If you have two exhaust pulses of equal volume, one in a 2" pipe and one in a 3" pipe, the pulse in the 2" pipe will be traveling considerably FASTER than the pulse in the 3" pipe. While it is true that the narrower the pipe, the higher the velocity of the exiting gases, you want make sure the pipe is wide enough so that there is as little backpressure as possible while maintaining suitable exhaust gas velocity. Backpressure in it's most extreme form can lead to reversion of the exhaust stream - that is to say the exhaust flows backwards, which is not good. The trick is to have a pipe that that is as narrow as possible while having as close to zero backpressure as possible at the RPM range you want your power band to be located at. Exhaust pipe diameters are best suited to a particular RPM range. A smaller pipe diameter will produce higher exhaust velocities at a lower RPM but create unacceptably high amounts of backpressure at high rpm. Thus if your powerband is located 2-3000 RPM you'd want a narrower pipe than if your powerband is located at 8-9000RPM.

 

Many engineers try to work around the RPM specific nature of pipe diameters by using setups that are capable of creating a similar effect as a change in pipe diameter on the fly. The most advanced is Ferrari's which consists of two exhaust paths after the header - at low RPM only one path is open to maintain exhaust velocity, but as RPM climbs and exhaust volume increases, the second path is opened to curb backpressure - since there is greater exhaust volume there is no loss in flow velocity. BMW and Nissan use a simpler and less effective method - there is a single exhaust path to the muffler; the muffler has two paths; one path is closed at low RPM but both are open at high RPM.

 

IV. So how did this myth come to be?

I often wonder how the myth "Engines need backpressure" came to be. Mostly I believe it is a misunderstanding of what is going on with the exhaust stream as pipe diameters change. For instance, someone with a civic decides he's going to uprade his exhaust with a 3" diameter piping. Once it's installed the owner notices that he seems to have lost a good bit of power throughout the powerband. He makes the connections in the following manner: "My wider exhaust eliminated all backpressure but I lost power, therefore the motor must need some backpressure in order to make power." What he did not realize is that he killed off all his flow velocity by using such a ridiculously wide pipe. It would have been possible for him to achieve close to zero backpressure with a much narrower pipe - in that way he would not have lost all his flow velocity.

 

V. So why is exhaust velocity so important?

The faster an exhaust pulse moves, the better it can scavenge out all of the spent gasses during valve overlap. The guiding principles of exhaust pulse scavenging are a bit beyond the scope of this doc but the general idea is a fast moving pulse creates a low pressure area behind it. This low pressure area acts as a vacuum and draws along the air behind it. A similar example would be a vehicle traveling at a high rate of speed on a dusty road. There is a low pressure area immediately behind the moving vehicle - dust particles get sucked into this low pressure area causing it to collect on the back of the vehicle. This effect is most noticeable on vans and hatchbacks which tend to create large trailing low pressure areas - giving rise to the numerous "wash me please" messages written in the thickly collected dust on the rear door(s).

[DenverDino]

This is serius issue.. i must go n check my rr8..

 

What is the capacity of the engine oil? (with n without oil filter change)

 

Engine Oil change with filter is 3L.

With filter change is 2.8L.

 

This state in the manual book hor...not my theory. hahahaha...

[DenverDino]

My butt is very sensitive, even using a different brand of petrol from the one I normally use, I can feel the roughness in the engine.

 

But honestly, I have not tried Extra on the RR8, maybe due to past experience, I've totally no interest in trying it again.

 

try verity 10-40w...good leh.

[mx_catfish]

I am tempted to personally check the engine oil level for you. When you've piled on about 1,000km, and if you're on, we can meet in SG for minum/makan, then I can check for you.

 

No problem. Will let you know if my next 1000km coming up...or next meeting.

[kinwei]

Ok, found it. The 2nd valve is to balance the flow capacity with velocity. After market pipes supposed to have done some R&D, and they would have balanced the flow capacity with velocity. However, if you look at the stock and after market power graphs, the after market curve usually dips below the stock pipe at lower RPMs.

 

V12Merlin here used to work for BS, and the Honda Japan mechs told him the same thing about the exhaust valve, it is there to give you more power at the lower end.

 

So when a local mech who can't properly complete a sentence without half filling it with vulgarities tell me, "knn, take out ah, take out aleady cb power ah", I'll always give them this look.

 

 

I. Introduction

One of the most misunderstood concepts in exhaust theory is backpressure. People love to talk about backpressure on message boards with no real understanding of what it is and what it's consequences are. I'm sure many of you have heard or read the phrase "Engines need backpressure" when discussing exhaust upgrades. That phrase is in fact completely inaccurate and a wholly misguided notion.

 

II. Some basic exhaust theory

Your exhaust system is designed to evacuate gases from the combustion chamber quickly and efficently. Exhaust gases are not produced in a smooth stream; exhaust gases originate in pulses. A 4 cylinder motor will have 4 distinct pulses per complete engine cycle, a 6 cylinder has 6 pules and so on. The more pulses that are produced, the more continuous the exhaust flow. Backpressure can be loosely defined as the resistance to positive flow - in this case, the resistance to positive flow of the exhaust stream.

 

III. Backpressure and velocity

Some people operate under the misguided notion that wider pipes are more effective at clearing the combustion chamber than narrower pipes. It's not hard to see how this misconception is appealing - wider pipes have the capability to flow more than narrower pipes. So if they have the ability to flow more, why isn't "wider is better" a good rule of thumb for exhaust upgrading? In a word - VELOCITY. I'm sure that all of you have at one time used a garden hose w/o a spray nozzle on it. If you let the water just run unrestricted out of the house it flows at a rather slow rate. However, if you take your finger and cover part of the opening, the water will flow out at a much much faster rate.

 

The astute exhaust designer knows that you must balance flow capacity with velocity. You want the exhaust gases to exit the chamber and speed along at the highest velocity possible - you want a FAST exhaust stream. If you have two exhaust pulses of equal volume, one in a 2" pipe and one in a 3" pipe, the pulse in the 2" pipe will be traveling considerably FASTER than the pulse in the 3" pipe. While it is true that the narrower the pipe, the higher the velocity of the exiting gases, you want make sure the pipe is wide enough so that there is as little backpressure as possible while maintaining suitable exhaust gas velocity. Backpressure in it's most extreme form can lead to reversion of the exhaust stream - that is to say the exhaust flows backwards, which is not good. The trick is to have a pipe that that is as narrow as possible while having as close to zero backpressure as possible at the RPM range you want your power band to be located at. Exhaust pipe diameters are best suited to a particular RPM range. A smaller pipe diameter will produce higher exhaust velocities at a lower RPM but create unacceptably high amounts of backpressure at high rpm. Thus if your powerband is located 2-3000 RPM you'd want a narrower pipe than if your powerband is located at 8-9000RPM.

 

Many engineers try to work around the RPM specific nature of pipe diameters by using setups that are capable of creating a similar effect as a change in pipe diameter on the fly. The most advanced is Ferrari's which consists of two exhaust paths after the header - at low RPM only one path is open to maintain exhaust velocity, but as RPM climbs and exhaust volume increases, the second path is opened to curb backpressure - since there is greater exhaust volume there is no loss in flow velocity. BMW and Nissan use a simpler and less effective method - there is a single exhaust path to the muffler; the muffler has two paths; one path is closed at low RPM but both are open at high RPM.

 

IV. So how did this myth come to be?

I often wonder how the myth "Engines need backpressure" came to be. Mostly I believe it is a misunderstanding of what is going on with the exhaust stream as pipe diameters change. For instance, someone with a civic decides he's going to uprade his exhaust with a 3" diameter piping. Once it's installed the owner notices that he seems to have lost a good bit of power throughout the powerband. He makes the connections in the following manner: "My wider exhaust eliminated all backpressure but I lost power, therefore the motor must need some backpressure in order to make power." What he did not realize is that he killed off all his flow velocity by using such a ridiculously wide pipe. It would have been possible for him to achieve close to zero backpressure with a much narrower pipe - in that way he would not have lost all his flow velocity.

 

V. So why is exhaust velocity so important?

The faster an exhaust pulse moves, the better it can scavenge out all of the spent gasses during valve overlap. The guiding principles of exhaust pulse scavenging are a bit beyond the scope of this doc but the general idea is a fast moving pulse creates a low pressure area behind it. This low pressure area acts as a vacuum and draws along the air behind it. A similar example would be a vehicle traveling at a high rate of speed on a dusty road. There is a low pressure area immediately behind the moving vehicle - dust particles get sucked into this low pressure area causing it to collect on the back of the vehicle. This effect is most noticeable on vans and hatchbacks which tend to create large trailing low pressure areas - giving rise to the numerous "wash me please" messages written in the thickly collected dust on the rear door(s).

 

An interesting read. Bigger engine normally tends to require the valve as mentioned. Normally their low end suffer as the exhaust normally cater to high flow for their mid to top end. Which it is why only the 1000cc gets the valve in the exhaust since the carb R1 days. It only until the later years where the 06/07 600/750 also get the exhuast valve as well.

[DenverDino]

how come no news on the Power Bronze rear hugger.

Edited March 9, 2009 by DenverDino