Need help!!

[Z i E z]

Recently I got involved in an accident..

Send my bike to repair.. cost more den 2k+

I've paid half of it... 1.3k on my own expense.. So i left only half

I even paid the few installments i lapse..

Now the bike shop still not letting me ride the bike

They are asking me to pay somemore for the repairs..

 

The question is, do they have any rights to hold my bike??

PLSS HELP!!

Edited May 20, 2009 by Z i E z

[apitBIOL]

why u send for repair at the shop u bought?? kene ketuk??

[Z i E z]

Actually I didn't send the bike to the shop i bought from...

I bought my bike from shop A.. But I send for repairs at Shop B

Somehow or rather Shop A and Shop B are related

Because i thought they could help me do a refinance on my installment

But they didn't.. instead I use my own money to do the repairs

1st they told me that they would proceed with the repairs after i pay my installment

ofcourse no black and white, only verbal agreement, so i waited

almost 2 mths and nothing is done.. checked with Shop B and they said Shop A have not called them yet

So I skip paying the installment and paid for the repairs...

Now I'm asking you guys, would you do the same??

What's the point of paying for the installment when anything is not even done to the bike?

How long would you guys willing to wait knowing that they didn't even do anything to your bike?

[Z i E z]

Pls help! need advice!

Maybe someone from CASE..

[Z i E z]

refer to this website..

i got the annoymous calls too..

 

http://sgforums.com/forums/13/topics/250917

[BlackBandit]

Why didn't you claim from insurance? Or was it a self-skid?

 

In this case, the bike company still has every legal right to hold the bike as you still have outstanding, both on the repairs as well as the installment payments. Til you settle all arrears, only then can you reclaim the bike.

[Z i E z]

Ok then, what about changing his words?

1st I came down to settle the installment..

cause he said I have to settle the installment 1st den bike can take out

after paying, I asked for the receipt..he refuse to give

saying that this money is for the repairs...so no receipt was given

Then what if he say i didn't pay anything at all..??

How could he say its for the repair while I wanted to pay for the installment..?

Where else a day ago I have paid Shop B the repair money..

At the end of the day.. bike cannot take out

Sian, have been waiting for almost 5 mths now for the repair

Imagine 5 mths?! How come so long?

 

2nd, before he said if I pay $700, I could owe him the balance but need a guarantor. But if i pay full cash I don't need one. Now after borrowing money from more den 5 ppl..

he said now I either need my fiancee photocopy I/C or a guarantor.

Why does he need my fiancee I/C nw? To disturb her?

What for a guarantor when im gonna pay full cash for the repairs?

Honestly I don't trust them..

Plz do advice..

[Nick_Lee]

Ok then, what about changing his words?

1st I came down to settle the installment..

cause he said I have to settle the installment 1st den bike can take out

after paying, I asked for the receipt..he refuse to give

saying that this money is for the repairs...so no receipt was given

Then what if he say i didn't pay anything at all..??

How could he say its for the repair while I wanted to pay for the installment..?

Where else a day ago I have paid Shop B the repair money..

At the end of the day.. bike cannot take out

Sian, have been waiting for almost 5 mths now for the repair

Imagine 5 mths?! How come so long?

 

2nd, before he said if I pay $700, I could owe him the balance but need a guarantor. But if i pay full cash I don't need one. Now after borrowing money from more den 5 ppl..

he said now I either need my fiancee photocopy I/C or a guarantor.

Why does he need my fiancee I/C nw? To disturb her?

What for a guarantor when im gonna pay full cash for the repairs?

Honestly I don't trust them..

Plz do advice..

 

i have to apologise before i comment because i dun think you will like what i am going to say.... but u asked for advice so i will give u one(or 2)...

 

firstly, i guess u are riding a bike which u bought from motor shop. you were late in paying ur installments, then u got into an accident. of which u didn't have enough $$ to pay. u paid half... plus ur installments... so i guess u really cannot afford to ride a bike, for whatever reasons. financial or family... and if u want to go into details of them changing their words, u have already gone back on urs when u didn't pay ur installments. so u are the one at fault before they lied... so go figure...

 

secondly, you bought the bike from the motorshop, they have every right to keep ur bike as u didn't pay them the installments owed, it shld be in the fiance contract u signed when u bought the bike from them. they dun have to repair it unless u paid in full, as they are worried that u will skip payment again... so frankly u can't blame them...

 

lastly, since u cannot afford to ride a bike. i suggest u sell the bike. there are no reasons for ppl to believe that u can't live without a bike, as u lived without 1 for the past 5 months. so my advice is to sell it... because... u simply can't afford to ride one,and in 5 month if u are working, u shld have enough $$ to repay the 1000$$... if u are not working. then no choice... sell it...

 

sorry again. but this is how i view things...

[BlackBandit]

ZiEz,

 

I agree with Nick. You are what you owe.

 

The written agreement between you and the bike shop is that you service the installments promptly. You have failed to honour that. The repairs are a different matter altogether. You cannot expect to divert your funds to the repairs & forgo the installments, and then expect the bike shop to be sympathetic to your cause.

 

It is the most basic responsibility that you service the installments promptly. The repairs should come from other standby funds or savings. If you have to resort to borrowing from 5 people just to pay off your motorcycle debts, perhaps you're not ready to own a vehicle yet. Wait until your situation improves or you're more financially stable.

[Z i E z]

What about after paying the installment i lapse,

I asked for the receipt..he refuse to give

saying that this money is for the repairs...

receipt was not given...anything bout that?

[Z i E z]

Btw guys, I admit that I'm not that well to do..

I'm just a normal Singaporean working my ass off and den get paid once a month.

I ride a bike is because of convenience..

I work in Tuas, and I'm staying in wlds

if I total up my MRT and Bus fares it would be the same..

I understand some of you guys are well to do..

but y look down on us? doesn't mean if we couldn't afford to pay for the repairs

we cannot afford to ride a bike...

FYI the total repairs cost is $2600..

I'm very sure not all can afford to pay this amount at once right?

So I'm just one of them.. trying to survive in this Pay And Pay country..

Anyway I appreciate the advice... Thx alot

[BlackBandit]

What about after paying the installment i lapse,

I asked for the receipt..he refuse to give

saying that this money is for the repairs...

receipt was not given...anything bout that?

 

Btw guys, I admit that I'm not that well to do..

I'm just a normal Singaporean working my ass off and den get paid once a month.

I ride a bike is because of convenience..

I work in Tuas, and I'm staying in wlds

if I total up my MRT and Bus fares it would be the same..

I understand some of you guys are well to do..

but y look down on us? doesn't mean if we couldn't afford to pay for the repairs

we cannot afford to ride a bike...

FYI the total repairs cost is $2600..

I'm very sure not all can afford to pay this amount at once right?

So I'm just one of them.. trying to survive in this Pay And Pay country..

Anyway I appreciate the advice... Thx alot

 

Dude,

you still don't get it. What the brothers here are giving you is advice. No one is putting you down. But the fact is simple. As long as you don't settle the arrears in installments as well as the cost of repairs, the bike shop still has every right to hold your bike. It does not matter where they push the money to, whether it is the repairs or the installments.

 

Some of the brothers here have been in your situation so we would understand. What I would have done in your situation is to continue servicing the installments and borrow (or tap into my savings) for the repairs.

 

But seriously, it is sound advice by Nick that perhaps you'd have to forgo the convenience of owning a bike until your financial situation improves. Another way would be to maximise the use of your bike. Work KFC/Pizza Hut/McDonald's delivery part-time and save the extra cash for a rainy day or emergencies such as this.

[Nick_Lee]

Btw guys, I admit that I'm not that well to do..

I'm just a normal Singaporean working my ass off and den get paid once a month.

I ride a bike is because of convenience..

I work in Tuas, and I'm staying in wlds

if I total up my MRT and Bus fares it would be the same..

I understand some of you guys are well to do..

but y look down on us? doesn't mean if we couldn't afford to pay for the repairs

we cannot afford to ride a bike...

FYI the total repairs cost is $2600..

I'm very sure not all can afford to pay this amount at once right?

So I'm just one of them.. trying to survive in this Pay And Pay country..

Anyway I appreciate the advice... Thx alot

 

hi... i am also a normal singaporean. working my ass off too... i too get paid once a month. i too am trying to survive in singapore... but does that mean that i am being looked down?? No... i think u got it wrong... u appreciate the advice but yet u feel that we looked down on you... i think u dun get it...

 

u said that u have a fiancee... i think if u are old enough to have one... u are old enough to manage ur finances and old enough to decide if u are financially sound enough to own a bike...

 

u said that u need a bike for transport... but u haven't owned 1 for 4 mths. and u are living fine... get another job if u really want a bike... and if u have a fiancee... u will need the extra $$ for ur wife... so get 2 jobs...

[Z i E z]

Ok my dear financially sound brother..

I got it .. Really ... thx for the advice..

Ride safely alright.. I don't want you to have the same fate as me

[racingter]

This thread is created to gather more infos and knowledges to be shared among fellow forumers.Any disputes or unagreeable replies and indirect cursing

among fellow members will be closely monitered.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Kind regards,

racingter

[IvikaRazI]

I guess have to agree with the rest also. To own a vehicle, need to consider many things.

 

Its like buying a car, Juz a ficticuous example, if you buy a 1.6l car, will need $1.6k every month to keep for the car needs. Even if you are paying $800 for the installments. The other half is to be used for rainy days like road tax, insurance and maintenance that comes by every now and then.

 

Anyway, sometimes I think using public transport is cheaper than owning a vehicle. No need to pay for petrol, no insurance, no road taxes, no maintenance, etc. On the downside, you only lose out in time.

 

Example. Motorcycle: 400cc, Petrol spend $100 per month, Road Tax: $10 per month, Maintenance every year: $120 per month, Insurance: $40 per month. Installments $300 per month. So in total will be spending like $570.

Public: SMRT/BUS: $5 one trip x 2 = $10 per day x 31 days (extreme) = $310.

 

So there is actually quite a lot of savings. Juz my 2 cents.

[crazydj]

Bro

 

Don't mind me asking, what bike do you ride? $2600 for repairs is the same cost as my bike! You know my colleagues never made fun of me riding a YBR. They all know that we riders ride certain bikes for certain reasons. If i had lotsa money, you think i would get a second hand despatch YBR? After a few months of riding, my colleagues are still asking me why i got a YBR. They intend to downgrade from their gilera/sp/kr/s4 to a bike like mine. My advice to you bro Z i E z, if you cannot pay, just let go of the bike. I had friends in your situation before. And i didnt pity them. I pitied their loved ones, being dragged into the same pit with my friends. Bro, if you think you can, borrow money and then take 2-3 other jobs. If not, just let go of your bike. You survived taking public transport didn't you? Good luck bro!

 

EDIT: FYI, it costs me ~$97.50 to maintain my bike a month.

Edited May 23, 2009 by crazydj

[Nick_Lee]

What about after paying the installment i lapse,

I asked for the receipt..he refuse to give

saying that this money is for the repairs...

receipt was not given...anything bout that?

 

u owe them 2600... even if u pay the installments... u still owe them for the repairs. they shld have issued a receipt for part of the repairs. i agree... but u shldn't have left until they issue 1... tell them u need 1 for prove that u have paid part of the reapirs... if not for the installments... otherwise call the police... then again they could have easily charged u for not paying ur installments... so its a double-edged sword...

 

Ok my dear financially sound brother..

I got it .. Really ... thx for the advice..

Ride safely alright.. I don't want you to have the same fate as me

 

hahaha... u ride safe... not me... u still feel that u are the victim when u did something wrong from the start... i think u shld start growing up... stop victimising urself... be a man and grow up pay ur debts instead of complaining over a virtual forum... u asked for advice and now u are sore before ppl advice and stated facts abt u which u dun agree with...

 

before u start another,"dear grown-up brother" thingy... i regret giving u any form of advice... shall not comment anymore... any comments pls pm me... cheers... ride safe becos i will nvr end up in a irresponsible situation like u... my financially un-sound, being always looked down fren...

Edited May 23, 2009 by Nick_Lee

[GuiNNeSS]

Recently I got involved in an accident..

Send my bike to repair.. cost more den 2k+

I've paid half of it... 1.3k on my own expense.. So i left only half

I even paid the few installments i lapse..

Now the bike shop still not letting me ride the bike

They are asking me to pay somemore for the repairs..

 

The question is, do they have any rights to hold my bike??

PLSS HELP!!

 

I refer to your very first post.

 

You lasped your installments. It is within the right of the finance company to engage a tow truck and tow your bike back to shop and sell the bike to cover the installments. Then for the remaining amount of money not paid for.

 

It IS within the right of the Finance Company and shop to issue legal letters to your garantor and yourself for the lasped payment as well as the penalty fees.

 

In the future, your garantor and yourself, if does not submit the full payments, will never be able to borrow any more money from banks, finance companies & take on any loans EVER.

 

You crashed the bike 2nd. Was it not you at the handlebar? Or was it the shop, finance companies or the rest of the road user's fault that you crashed? Is the rest of us supposed to be sympathatic to someone who does not have the mindset that one should prepare for emergencies?

 

Does this mean, that you have a child. Your wife will need to one day stand at the door with a crying baby to wait for you to return home with enough milk powder to feed your child?

 

Did you NOT got what everyone is trying to tell you?

 

We here at this forum, most of us have lived from hand to mouth. You think just because you can also post on this forum, has the RIGHT to suggest anyone else is more well off then yourself? If that is so. Really. Consider walking instead of biking to work.

 

I've done it. Can you really try to suggest you are better financially with a bike? Because at this moment, its obvious you got someone else into finance trouble too. Must be your garantor deserve it, since its obvious you dont seem to be able to see yourself at fault and is looking for a fight even though you are in the wrong.

 

I pity your garantor.

[apitBIOL]

bro, what bike are u riding?!!? repair until $2600

[civicblade]

Repair shops have no right to withhold your vehicle after repairs.

 

Call the police to help you regain possession of your vehicle if need to.

 

The repair shop should release your vehicle to you and invoice you for the repair work.

 

If you do not have the means to pay, the repair shop can go to the courts to do the necessary.. mediate through the court for installment payment, get a court order to go to your house and take whatever necessary or of value for auction or get court order to take money straight from your bank account.. last resort declare you bankrupt if you owe more than $10k.

 

If you laspe in hire purchase installments, it is different, the contract clearly says that the "owner = bikeshop" can repossess your vehicle and sell it off or charge you for storage or administrative fees.

 

If the bike is yours or under hire purchase with another shop not the repair shop, is it illegal for the repair shop to hold your vehicle.

 

Cases like this where the repair or bikeshop takes advantage of riders (consumers) are very sad. There is hardly any business ethics. If you were to ask the repairs/bikeshop why they do such things to riders... their reply will always be that they need to make a living.. by taking advantage of riders.

 

I've had my fair share of being taken advantage of when I was new to bikes. I learnt my lessons the hard way, paying "learning fees" to the bikeshops. When I just started riding, there were some more experienced bikers who would recommend sound choices of first 2B bikes and shops that relatively more honest but as a young kid.. I just wouldn't take their advice. Only myself to blame.

 

 

Why didn't you claim from insurance? Or was it a self-skid?

 

In this case, the bike company still has every legal right to hold the bike as you still have outstanding, both on the repairs as well as the installment payments. Til you settle all arrears, only then can you reclaim the bike.

[BlackBandit]

civicblade,

I am not trying to side with the bike shop but if you read TS' posts, he mentioned that he still has prior outstanding on the installments even before the repairs. TS' credibility of prompt payment probably worries the bike shop. In this case, the bikeshop pushed the money he paid for installments to the repairs, meaning he still has outstanding on the installments. Both bike shops are furthermore linked to each other, probably through ownership. As a business, they have to come up with the costs of the parts and repairs beforehand and it'll be tedious if they have problems recovering this amount. This is a grey area which can only be mediated through litigation. Even calling the police will not help. Also, I would not say that it the bike shops are taking advantage of TS if TS still has outstanding arrears to be paid.

 

I have been in a serious accident before but since I was prompt in payment and have stable income, the bike shop did not have any problems repairing my bike first since they're confident they can recover the amount from me even if the insurers fail to pay up. I took the bike back within 2 weeks.

 

And TS, if it makes you feel better, I was 27 before I got my first vehicle because I felt that I had too many liabilities before that. And I upgraded only when I felt that I can afford the basic costs as well as any emergencies.

 

According to the Hire-Purchase Act, until the full amount is settled, the owner is still the bikeshop whilst TS is the hirer (http://statutes.agc.gov.sg/). The only quick way I can see out of this conundrum (that is TS insists that he should be riding his bike) is when TS settles the full amount of the repairs as well as the outstanding installments.

 

Excerpts of Hire Purchase Act Chapter 125

Interpretation

2. —(1) In this Act —

 

"action" includes counterclaim and set-off;

 

 

"dealer" means a person, not being the hirer or the owner or a servant of the owner, by whom or on whose behalf negotiations leading to the making of a hire-purchase agreement with the owner were carried out or by whom or on whose behalf the transaction leading to a hire-purchase agreement with the owner was arranged;

 

"goods" includes any replacement or renewal by the hirer of any part or parts thereof and any accessory added or addition made thereto by the hirer during the period of the hiring;

 

"guarantor" means a person who has guaranteed the performance by a hirer of all or any of his obligations under a hire-purchase agreement but does not include the dealer or a person engaged, at the time of the giving of the guarantee, in the trade or business of selling goods of the same nature or description as the goods comprised in the agreement;

 

"hire-purchase agreement" includes a letting of goods with an option to purchase and an agreement for the purchase of goods by instalments (whether the agreement describes the instalments as rent or hire or otherwise), but does not include any agreement —

 

(a) whereby the property in the goods comprised therein passes at the time of the agreement or upon or at any time before delivery of the goods; or

 

(b) under which the person by whom the goods are being hired or purchased is a person who is engaged in the trade or business of selling goods of the same nature or description as the goods comprised in the agreement;

 

"hire-purchase price" means the total sum payable by the hirer under a hire-purchase agreement in order to complete the purchase of goods to which the agreement relates, exclusive of any sum payable as a penalty or as compensation or damages for a breach of the agreement;

 

"hirer" means the person who takes or has taken goods from an owner under a hire-purchase agreement and includes a person to whom the hirer’s rights or liabilities under the agreement have passed by assignment or by operation of law;

 

"motor vehicle" means a motor vehicle within the meaning of the Road Traffic Act;

 

"owner" means a person who lets or has let goods to a hirer under a hire-purchase agreement and includes a person to whom the owner’s rights or liabilities under the agreement have passed by assignment or by operation of law;

 

"third-party insurance" means any insurance in relation to liability in respect of death or bodily injury caused by or arising out of the use of a motor vehicle being insurance required by law;

 

"vehicle registration fees" means any amount to be provided under a hire-purchase agreement by the owner for payment by or on behalf of the hirer under the provisions of this Act in connection with the registration and use of a motor vehicle, including any amount payable for third-party insurance and for the issue of a certificate of entitlement.

Edited May 24, 2009 by BlackBandit

[WawanAprilia]

I crashed my YBR .. Changed meter , mudguard , swingarm , handlebar and headlight .. Guess how much it costs ?? $600 .. Are u riding a sports bike ? Sports bike a lil tidious to maintain so its advisable to ride a normal average bike ... U might want to degrade ya bike ...

[crazydj]

I crashed my YBR .. Changed meter , mudguard , swingarm , handlebar and headlight .. Guess how much it costs ?? $600 .. Are u riding a sports bike ? Sports bike a lil tidious to maintain so its advisable to ride a normal average bike ... U might want to degrade ya bike ...

 

Dude. YBR so expensive to repair? What happened? Care to share how you crashed it?

[civicblade]

Hi BlackBandit,

 

I'm stating a general case where the repair shop and the owner shop is two separate entity.

 

It could be complicated in the thread starter's case.

 

I'm not siding with the TS.

 

i'm more concerned about new riders being overcharged by repair shops.

 

It is good that you have brought up the hire-purchase contract terms. It is time riders knows exactly what they are getting into when they sign on the dotted line of the hire-purchase agreement.

 

civicblade,

I am not trying to side with the bike shop but if you read TS' posts, he mentioned that he still has prior outstanding on the installments even before the repairs. TS' credibility of prompt payment probably worries the bike shop. In this case, the bikeshop pushed the money he paid for installments to the repairs, meaning he still has outstanding on the installments. Both bike shops are furthermore linked to each other, probably through ownership. As a business, they have to come up with the costs of the parts and repairs beforehand and it'll be tedious if they have problems recovering this amount. This is a grey area which can only be mediated through litigation. Even calling the police will not help. Also, I would not say that it the bike shops are taking advantage of TS if TS still has outstanding arrears to be paid.

 

I have been in a serious accident before but since I was prompt in payment and have stable income, the bike shop did not have any problems repairing my bike first since they're confident they can recover the amount from me even if the insurers fail to pay up. I took the bike back within 2 weeks.

 

And TS, if it makes you feel better, I was 27 before I got my first vehicle because I felt that I had too many liabilities before that. And I upgraded only when I felt that I can afford the basic costs as well as any emergencies.

 

According to the Hire-Purchase Act, until the full amount is settled, the owner is still the bikeshop whilst TS is the hirer (http://statutes.agc.gov.sg/). The only quick way I can see out of this conundrum (that is TS insists that he should be riding his bike) is when TS settles the full amount of the repairs as well as the outstanding installments.

 

Excerpts of Hire Purchase Act Chapter 125

Interpretation

2. —(1) In this Act —

 

"action" includes counterclaim and set-off;

 

 

"dealer" means a person, not being the hirer or the owner or a servant of the owner, by whom or on whose behalf negotiations leading to the making of a hire-purchase agreement with the owner were carried out or by whom or on whose behalf the transaction leading to a hire-purchase agreement with the owner was arranged;

 

"goods" includes any replacement or renewal by the hirer of any part or parts thereof and any accessory added or addition made thereto by the hirer during the period of the hiring;

 

"guarantor" means a person who has guaranteed the performance by a hirer of all or any of his obligations under a hire-purchase agreement but does not include the dealer or a person engaged, at the time of the giving of the guarantee, in the trade or business of selling goods of the same nature or description as the goods comprised in the agreement;

 

"hire-purchase agreement" includes a letting of goods with an option to purchase and an agreement for the purchase of goods by instalments (whether the agreement describes the instalments as rent or hire or otherwise), but does not include any agreement —

 

(a) whereby the property in the goods comprised therein passes at the time of the agreement or upon or at any time before delivery of the goods; or

 

(b) under which the person by whom the goods are being hired or purchased is a person who is engaged in the trade or business of selling goods of the same nature or description as the goods comprised in the agreement;

 

"hire-purchase price" means the total sum payable by the hirer under a hire-purchase agreement in order to complete the purchase of goods to which the agreement relates, exclusive of any sum payable as a penalty or as compensation or damages for a breach of the agreement;

 

"hirer" means the person who takes or has taken goods from an owner under a hire-purchase agreement and includes a person to whom the hirer’s rights or liabilities under the agreement have passed by assignment or by operation of law;

 

"motor vehicle" means a motor vehicle within the meaning of the Road Traffic Act;

 

"owner" means a person who lets or has let goods to a hirer under a hire-purchase agreement and includes a person to whom the owner’s rights or liabilities under the agreement have passed by assignment or by operation of law;

 

"third-party insurance" means any insurance in relation to liability in respect of death or bodily injury caused by or arising out of the use of a motor vehicle being insurance required by law;

 

"vehicle registration fees" means any amount to be provided under a hire-purchase agreement by the owner for payment by or on behalf of the hirer under the provisions of this Act in connection with the registration and use of a motor vehicle, including any amount payable for third-party insurance and for the issue of a certificate of entitlement.