[cdc] 2b

timewalker84 · April 12, 2013

Yes, im trying to make it second nature for me to look where im going.
And the abs thing, isit like semi-flicking the bike?

Seems like you got the gist of it. Essentially, when u flex one side of your abs like a belly dancer, your knee is forced to follow through, pushing the bike in the direction you require.

At narrow turns, it's this same abs-flex technique which bikers unconsciously use to lean away from the curve and force the bike into a controlled countersteer.

Nabil SugarBoy · April 12, 2013

Seems like you got the gist of it. Essentially, when u flex one side of your abs like a belly dancer, your knee is forced to follow through, pushing the bike in the direction you require.

At narrow turns, it's this same abs-flex technique which bikers unconsciously use to lean away from the curve and force the bike into a controlled countersteer.

Alright, i'll try to practice on this more. I just love cornerings. Even with malaysian kups

rijac · April 12, 2013

I got lucky. today's 4.25 session opened up so I grabbed it. passed lesson 2. saved 1 week.. was supposed to go on next weds. now next week can do lesson 3.

darkredmica · April 12, 2013

I got lucky. today's 4.25 session opened up so I grabbed it. passed lesson 2. saved 1 week.. was supposed to go on next weds. now next week can do lesson 3.

Please enlighten us! What is lesson 2 about!?

Nabil SugarBoy · April 12, 2013

I got lucky. today's 4.25 session opened up so I grabbed it. passed lesson 2. saved 1 week.. was supposed to go on next weds. now next week can do lesson 3.

Nice one bro!

feriosi · April 12, 2013

3 tips for u bro:

1) Look where u want to go, not where u are going. This is the number one tip for all bikers. When u-turning at the end of the figure 8, your face should be AT LEAST 90 degrees away from your front.

2) When you get your form right after applying tip no. 1, you may find urself moving too fast around the figure 8. To control ur speed, it is necessary to apply ur rear brake slightly.

3) Lastly, it may help to use ur abs muscles like a belly dancer to help u turn ur bike at sharp angles (at the turn of the figure 8). People use it to achieve good timings through the pylon slalom. There's no real way to teach you how to do this, except to encourage you to give it a try and see for yourself!

Add-on to point 2 - Do not use the front brake at all.

4) Don't be afraid of falling, accelerate a bit more before u shift to 2nd gear to prevent wobbling, control your acceleration and rear brake.

Hope it helps. Good luck.

rijac · April 12, 2013

Please enlighten us! What is lesson 2 about!?

lesson 2 is all about left turn, right turn, change lanes and the safety checks as you do each one of these. you will practice turning at all the different kind of junctions - stop line, traffic light. no traffic light/no stop line.

the lesson starts with a very long 'lecture' at the pondok. instructor will show you the route on the map and what you must do at each turn. its a very long briefing as he will tell you what to do at all the junctions - if you have bad memory sure jialat one (lol).

it starts outside the roundabout where you did your lesson 1. at the first main junction there is a stop line (MUST STOP exactly at the line even if you already stopped 1 foot from the line). here you will do a left turn towards the bike lesson reporting station. you will pass the canteen on your right and don't forget to look out for pedestrians at the crossing. you will take a sharp left after the zebra crossing. straight past the figure 8/crank course (need to filter right and back to the left if there are bikes waiting to enter figure 8).

left turn at the traffic lights right after the figure 8 course. after turning left you will be at the same road where you started but now you must change lane to the right and do a right turn at the same main (STOP LINE MUST STOP) junction. after turning right, change lane to the left then follow the road round the bend and then change lane back to the right to make a right turn. go straight and turn right at the traffic light junction. after turning right you will be back at the same road you started at but now you must filter to the left lane and reach the main road junction (STOP LINE MUST STOP) where you started and repeat all over again and again and again.

so you are actually doing a big figure 8 around the roads inside CDC.

what you need to do:

1. use the left and right signal. must off the signal after completing the turn. must also signal for changing lanes

2. must do the CORRECT safety checks and blind spot checks at each turn and each time you change lane or go round a bend (and the correct number of times - e.g. if he say 1 blind spot check to the right, don't go and do 2)

3. they will teach you how to form up at the different junctions (if arrow on road is single direction, form up in 2 lines, if arrow is turning + straight, form up in 1 line)

there are 2 types of safety checks - check back (safety check) and blind spot check. what is the difference? simple to remember - blind spot check when you are moving, check back when you are not moving and about to move off. they are very particular about these checks. each time you do wrong 2 points. if you do 10 wrong during your tp 20 points easily!

which direction to do the check back and blind spot check?

for blind spot check it is easy - same direction as your turn or lane change or bend. e.g if you are turning left, blind spot check to the left, if you are changing lane to the right, blind spot check to the right.

for 'check back' it is almost always to the right. before moving off EVERY TIME YOU STOP you must check back to the right. if you stop and inch forward 50 times, you must check back 50 times every time you start to inch forward.

there only time you do check back to the left is when you are going to turn left from stationary (e.g. at the first main left turn stop line and at the traffic light if you had stopped for a red light). but remember, you must do right check back AND left check back in these situations.

if you reach traffic light for left turn and it is green, you turn without stopping (remember to do blind spot check to the left). if you reach traffic light junction for right turn and it is green, you must monitor for traffic from the front and stop if you have to. remember, if you didn't stop due to clear traffic, do a blind spot check to the right and if you did stop due to traffic, do a check back to the right and a blind spot check just as you turn right.

hope this helps.

rijac · April 12, 2013

Lesson 2 Route Map. Note the yellow line and direction. Turns are numbered. these are my numbers, the actual turn number might be different over there. i can't recall. at number 1 and number 4 it is a stop line. must stop at the line every time. at turn one, you must check back right and check back left and then check blind spot to the left while turning left. after turn 1, remember to check blind spot on the left at the bend. after turn 2, be aware of any bikes stopped at the entrance of figure 8 - if yes, you have to change lane to the right (check blind spot to the right) and then change lane back to the left (check blind spot to the left) to get ready for turn 3.

after turn 3 you must change lane to the right (check blind spot on the right). at turn 4 you must do only check back to the right when moving off. after turn four change lane to the left (check blind spot to the left)... before turn 5 change lane to the right (check blind spot to the right). after turn 6 you must change lane to the left (check blind spot to the left!).

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8250/8643245593_fa17104da6_b.jpg

Shadowluva · April 14, 2013

How much does the elbow+knee pads cost at the centre? Is it sold at the counter or the shop beside the office?

Nabil SugarBoy · April 14, 2013

How much does the elbow+knee pads cost at the centre? Is it sold at the counter or the shop beside the office?

It's $25. I got some pairs for sale, selling it at $17.

darkredmica · April 15, 2013

lesson 2 is all about left turn, right turn, change lanes and the safety checks as you do each one of these. you will practice turning at all the different kind of junctions - stop line, traffic light. no traffic light/no stop line.

the lesson starts with a very long 'lecture' at the pondok. instructor will show you the route on the map and what you must do at each turn. its a very long briefing as he will tell you what to do at all the junctions - if you have bad memory sure jialat one (lol).

it starts outside the roundabout where you did your lesson 1. at the first main junction there is a stop line (MUST STOP exactly at the line even if you already stopped 1 foot from the line). here you will do a left turn towards the bike lesson reporting station. you will pass the canteen on your right and don't forget to look out for pedestrians at the crossing. you will take a sharp left after the zebra crossing. straight past the figure 8/crank course (need to filter right and back to the left if there are bikes waiting to enter figure 8).
left turn at the traffic lights right after the figure 8 course. after turning left you will be at the same road where you started but now you must change lane to the right and do a right turn at the same main (STOP LINE MUST STOP) junction. after turning right, change lane to the left then follow the road round the bend and then change lane back to the right to make a right turn. go straight and turn right at the traffic light junction. after turning right you will be back at the same road you started at but now you must filter to the left lane and reach the main road junction (STOP LINE MUST STOP) where you started and repeat all over again and again and again.

so you are actually doing a big figure 8 around the roads inside CDC.

what you need to do:
1. use the left and right signal. must off the signal after completing the turn. must also signal for changing lanes
2. must do the CORRECT safety checks and blind spot checks at each turn and each time you change lane or go round a bend (and the correct number of times - e.g. if he say 1 blind spot check to the right, don't go and do 2)
3. they will teach you how to form up at the different junctions (if arrow on road is single direction, form up in 2 lines, if arrow is turning + straight, form up in 1 line)

there are 2 types of safety checks - check back (safety check) and blind spot check. what is the difference? simple to remember - blind spot check when you are moving, check back when you are not moving and about to move off. they are very particular about these checks. each time you do wrong 2 points. if you do 10 wrong during your tp 20 points easily!

which direction to do the check back and blind spot check?

for blind spot check it is easy - same direction as your turn or lane change or bend. e.g if you are turning left, blind spot check to the left, if you are changing lane to the right, blind spot check to the right.

for 'check back' it is almost always to the right. before moving off EVERY TIME YOU STOP you must check back to the right. if you stop and inch forward 50 times, you must check back 50 times every time you start to inch forward.

there only time you do check back to the left is when you are going to turn left from stationary (e.g. at the first main left turn stop line and at the traffic light if you had stopped for a red light). but remember, you must do right check back AND left check back in these situations.

if you reach traffic light for left turn and it is green, you turn without stopping (remember to do blind spot check to the left). if you reach traffic light junction for right turn and it is green, you must monitor for traffic from the front and stop if you have to. remember, if you didn't stop due to clear traffic, do a blind spot check to the right and if you did stop due to traffic, do a check back to the right and a blind spot check just as you turn right.

hope this helps.

Very very detailed bro! Thanks for letting us know in advance so we roughly know what to expect.

I think it is similar to driving uh.

Except the fact that we need to balance as well on the bike.

I have a bad memory so I guess I am gonna do terribly haha.

PLUS, yet to book my pract. No available slot this week. Terrible!!

rijac · April 15, 2013

if you drive often then you will know the rules of negotiating the different junctions. so that part is easy. where you need to concentrate is bike handling - have to remember to signal and then off the signal (not like car, which is automatic off), and sometimes you have to operate clutch and change gear while doing this. i struggled a bit because the bike i used had a very high clutch biting point and hard to press. so by the first round my left hand was aching like hell. so check the clutch when picking your bike. the other key is exaggerate your checks... turn your head and look behind your shoulder. a lot of ppl just turn right turn left but not really looking. not just to please the instructor but for safety ah.. some of the car drivers there CMI. haha

darkredmica · April 15, 2013

if you drive often then you will know the rules of negotiating the different junctions. so that part is easy. where you need to concentrate is bike handling - have to remember to signal and then off the signal (not like car, which is automatic off), and sometimes you have to operate clutch and change gear while doing this. i struggled a bit because the bike i used had a very high clutch biting point and hard to press. so by the first round my left hand was aching like hell. so check the clutch when picking your bike. the other key is exaggerate your checks... turn your head and look behind your shoulder. a lot of ppl just turn right turn left but not really looking. not just to please the instructor but for safety ah.. some of the car drivers there CMI. haha

Yeah I think have to juggle bike handling, plus all the necessary checks is difficult. For my pract 1 the last time, by half of the pract.. My wrist alr aching from clutching in and all.

Checking blindspot etc for car is easy because we are all seated in comfort. Bike there's just so many things to take note and oh yes, signal have to manually close uh. If you never mention I also won't know! Haha. Well... I am one of those CMI rider. Haha. How to check for the bike when choosing? BTW, for pract 2 onwards, using bike with mirror, if I fall, will I damage the mirror?

Idk if you all have chance across bikes that always stuck at neutral gear? Like when you are trying to change to gear 1 but it is just stuck at neutral. Then instructor will ask you to release the clutch and clutch in fast... What's the problem? Is it cuz we never clutch in fast enough when trying to change gear?

timewalker84 · April 15, 2013

Almost 3 years ago, I was a new 2B rider with 6 years of daily driving experience - that driving experience created bad habits which led to at least 2 of my accidents as a new rider.

I'd like to share some of these mistakes, seeing as so many of u are also drivers. Hopefully u can learn from my stupidity and avoid the same pitfalls.

1) Accelerating towards a green light - while driving, we tend to accelerate towards green lights. If the light turns at the last minute, we always have the last minute option to jam brake to avoid beating the light (esp if there's red light camera). As bikers, we do not have that luxury. In my second month as a 2B P-plater, I was accelerating towards a junction at 80km/h on my SP, when the light turned red. At the last minute, I saw a red light camera, panicked and jammed my brakes hard. I skidded hard, and ended up torn and bleeding on the road. Seeing my beloved SP torn and broken beside me was truly heartbreaking and painful.

2) Tailgating and following distance- As a driver, I was used to following cars closely on an expressway. As a biker, that mistake almost proved fatal when I ebraked on a rainy day and skidded across 2 lanes of expressway on my 2nd bike - a KIPS.

As a biker on the expressway, you should triple your usual following distance or more. Bike brakes are a lot weaker, and unless u want to find yourself plastered against someone's boot, it's important to keep a wide following distance so that u can react in time to a car's ebrake maneouvre (esp BMWs). Nothing personal against BMW drivers, but I find that many BMW drivers tend to brake hard, and BMW brakes are ruthlessly powerful.

3) Looking far - as a driver, scanning far is not as important as it is when u are a biker. As a biker, your brakes are weaker, and it is far more important to really scan the road ahead of you for vehicles with the intention of cutting into your lane suddenly - the ability to sense a bad driver's careless intentions is very important. Especially while lanesplitting.

4) Side mirrors - As drivers, sometimes we tend to get careless and spend too long looking at our side mirrors when lane changing. This carelessness can be very fatal for bikers. If the car in front brakes hard while a driver is checking his mirrors, a collision may be avoided by ebraking, and a front-to-boot accident is unlikely to be fatal anyway. For a biker, this sort of accident is very often fatal.

5) Spiral multistorey carparks, roundabouts - when going round spiral multistorey carparks, it is natural as a driver to look forward, and hardly do you see anyone looking out of the driver's side window. On a bike going up a spiral carpark, you really have to look where u want to go, and not straight ahead.

Developing good biking habits will make you a better and safer driver as well!

timewalker84 · April 15, 2013

Yeah I think have to juggle bike handling, plus all the necessary checks is difficult. For my pract 1 the last time, by half of the pract.. My wrist alr aching from clutching in and all.

Checking blindspot etc for car is easy because we are all seated in comfort. Bike there's just so many things to take note and oh yes, signal have to manually close uh. If you never mention I also won't know! Haha. Well... I am one of those CMI rider. Haha. How to check for the bike when choosing? BTW, for pract 2 onwards, using bike with mirror, if I fall, will I damage the mirror?

Idk if you all have chance across bikes that always stuck at neutral gear? Like when you are trying to change to gear 1 but it is just stuck at neutral. Then instructor will ask you to release the clutch and clutch in fast... What's the problem? Is it cuz we never clutch in fast enough when trying to change gear?

It seems like a lot to do now cos u aren't experienced. Over time, everything becomes simple, and biking will become as reflexive and natural as driving.

Stuck at neutral is a very common problem, especially with school bikes. Kick down hard and solidly. If you tap lightly, the bike will naturally go to neutral. Same with going from gear 1 to gear 2 - kick up solidly.

Dun think the mirror will break. The crash bars should prevent that. If break, it's the school's problem anyway - they won't and can't make u pay for the damage.

timewalker84 · April 15, 2013

if you drive often then you will know the rules of negotiating the different junctions. so that part is easy. where you need to concentrate is bike handling - have to remember to signal and then off the signal (not like car, which is automatic off), and sometimes you have to operate clutch and change gear while doing this. i struggled a bit because the bike i used had a very high clutch biting point and hard to press. so by the first round my left hand was aching like hell. so check the clutch when picking your bike. the other key is exaggerate your checks... turn your head and look behind your shoulder. a lot of ppl just turn right turn left but not really looking. not just to please the instructor but for safety ah.. some of the car drivers there CMI. haha

If the biting point is too far, let ur instructor know - there's a screw mechanism near the clutch lever, and he can adjust the biting point for you on the spot. Dun suffer in silence.

Maldini03 · April 15, 2013

As a rider since 1998 i shared my experience on safely of biking.

when approaching traffic junction, observed the sign on the pedestrian crossing. If the pedestrian crossing is green man changing to red it means the green light is changing to red soon. slow down and prepare to stop.

if it is green man or blinking green man then it is safe to go. this way you can avoid beating red light camera.

Edited April 15, 2013 by Maldini03

timewalker84 · April 15, 2013

As a rider since 1998 i shared my experience on safely of biking.

when approaching traffic junction, observed the sign on the pedestrian crossing. If the pedestrian crossing is green man changing to red it means the green light is changing to red soon. slow down and prepare to stop.

if it is green man or blinking green man then it is safe to go. this way you can avoid beating red light camera.

Yep, gd stuff! But works only at cross junctions, not on straight roads with only pedestrian crossing. Along Holland Road near Ulu Pandan there's this stupid pedestrian crossing with a red light camera (dunno for wat put red light camera there also).

Maldini03 · April 15, 2013

well said by timewalker. Dun woory abt falling and repeating prac. I took 22 lesson for 8 practical. I felt demoralised and disappointed, i can cornered very well but still fail figure 8 and u turn. Eventually i understand that safely mindset and all this prac makes me a better rider. I get more time to practised the obstacle and passed my 2b tp 1st time.

for me

1st prac 2 time

2nd prac 3time

3rd prac 4 time

4 prac 3 time

5 prac 1 time

6 prac 3 time

7prac 3 time

8prac 3 time.

2b tp 1st time.

Edited April 15, 2013 by Maldini03

rijac · April 15, 2013

yes, we all pick up bad habits when driving cars. but technically, if we drive often we should know what the rules are even if we don't follow and that knowledge should help us. For e.g. we all know we are supposed to stop at a stop sign behind the white line. but we don't do it. but if we know this we should be able to remember during the lesson and TP test. etc.

keyxblade · April 15, 2013

Almost 3 years ago, I was a new 2B rider with 6 years of daily driving experience - that driving experience created bad habits which led to at least 2 of my accidents as a new rider.

I'd like to share some of these mistakes, seeing as so many of u are also drivers. Hopefully u can learn from my stupidity and avoid the same pitfalls.

1) Accelerating towards a green light - while driving, we tend to accelerate towards green lights. If the light turns at the last minute, we always have the last minute option to jam brake to avoid beating the light (esp if there's red light camera). As bikers, we do not have that luxury. In my second month as a 2B P-plater, I was accelerating towards a junction at 80km/h on my SP, when the light turned red. At the last minute, I saw a red light camera, panicked and jammed my brakes hard. I skidded hard, and ended up torn and bleeding on the road. Seeing my beloved SP torn and broken beside me was truly heartbreaking and painful.

2) Tailgating and following distance- As a driver, I was used to following cars closely on an expressway. As a biker, that mistake almost proved fatal when I ebraked on a rainy day and skidded across 2 lanes of expressway on my 2nd bike - a KIPS.

As a biker on the expressway, you should triple your usual following distance or more. Bike brakes are a lot weaker, and unless u want to find yourself plastered against someone's boot, it's important to keep a wide following distance so that u can react in time to a car's ebrake maneouvre (esp BMWs). Nothing personal against BMW drivers, but I find that many BMW drivers tend to brake hard, and BMW brakes are ruthlessly powerful.

3) Looking far - as a driver, scanning far is not as important as it is when u are a biker. As a biker, your brakes are weaker, and it is far more important to really scan the road ahead of you for vehicles with the intention of cutting into your lane suddenly - the ability to sense a bad driver's careless intentions is very important. Especially while lanesplitting.

4) Side mirrors - As drivers, sometimes we tend to get careless and spend too long looking at our side mirrors when lane changing. This carelessness can be very fatal for bikers. If the car in front brakes hard while a driver is checking his mirrors, a collision may be avoided by ebraking, and a front-to-boot accident is unlikely to be fatal anyway. For a biker, this sort of accident is very often fatal.

5) Spiral multistorey carparks, roundabouts - when going round spiral multistorey carparks, it is natural as a driver to look forward, and hardly do you see anyone looking out of the driver's side window. On a bike going up a spiral carpark, you really have to look where u want to go, and not straight ahead.

Developing good biking habits will make you a better and safer driver as well!

wah seems like u jam brake alot. May be u want to try braking with 2 fingers? bec when emergency ppl tend to brake too hard, if you brake with 2 fingers no matter how hard u press also wont jam brake.

timewalker84 · April 15, 2013

wah seems like u jam brake alot. May be u want to try braking with 2 fingers? bec when emergency ppl tend to brake too hard, if you brake with 2 fingers no matter how hard u press also wont jam brake.

I'll give it a try, but I dun skid anymore. I just humji and go slower - it's been effective so far

rijac · April 15, 2013

I'm 3 for 3 but I think I barely scrapped through my lesson 3 tonight. Kept having problems getting into 2nd gear for figure 8 and crank course. Instructor said I need to accelerate faster at the beginning. Need to practice.

Sent from my GT-N7000 using Tapatalk 2

Maldini03 · April 15, 2013

by the way how much is a lesson nowaday? In 1999 it is $16.50 i think.

rijac · April 15, 2013

20 off peak and 24 peak

Sent from my GT-N7000 using Tapatalk 2

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