Loud Pipes Saves Lives

[rickzhee]

Pertaining to the high motorcycle accident rates recently, we could use this hour to highlight to relevant authorities that IT IS A FACT THAT LOUD EXHAUST PIPES SAVES LIVES.

 

It may sound ridiculous & not realistic to write in on this request to re-write the laws against loud exhaust pipes but with the right justification with statistics of increased motorcycle accidents after the enforcement of loud pipes & expostulation it could be accomplished.

 

What we need is someone who is proficient in composing the memorandum to the Straits Times Forum with petitions from registered biker groups if better with backings from professionals in health care.

 

We could make it happen...

[Tyrian]

i beg to differ.. although loud pipes does "save" lifes, it contributes to noise pollution, which will increase the already high stress level in the singapore society.. u don't want a noisy road do you?

 

in what examples does loud pipe saves lifes? it is for inconsiderate jaywalkers and pedestrians in general.. if everyone practices road courtesy, do we need traffic lights in the first place?

 

honestly speaking, i hate those 2-strokers loud pipes especially those malaysian cubs which at the same time emits smoke level beyond human tolarantion.. harleys? i dislike the loud bassy sound too.. but at least they aren't as defening as those high pitched kips, sp, tzm, rxz who modded their pipes..

 

i believe in educating the road users (and fine them the cheng hu way), but at the same time, given singaporean's road user's attitute, i believe it will take a very long time or almost impossible to acomplish..

[fila11]

i beg to differ.. although loud pipes does "save" lifes, it contributes to noise pollution, which will increase the already high stress level in the singapore society.. u don't want a noisy road do you?

 

in what examples does loud pipe saves lifes? it is for inconsiderate jaywalkers and pedestrians in general.. if everyone practices road courtesy, do we need traffic lights in the first place?

 

honestly speaking, i hate those 2-strokers loud pipes especially those malaysian cubs which at the same time emits smoke level beyond human tolarantion.. harleys? i dislike the loud bassy sound too.. but at least they aren't as defening as those high pitched kips, sp, tzm, rxz who modded their pipes..

 

i believe in educating the road users (and fine them the cheng hu way), but at the same time, given singaporean's road user's attitute, i believe it will take a very long time or almost impossible to acomplish..

 

ya..i agree...original pipe is the best!

[patriots]

Originally posted by rickzhee@Dec 22 2004, 10:43 AM

Pertaining to the high motorcycle accident rates recently, we could use this hour to highlight to relevant authorities that IT IS A FACT THAT LOUD EXHAUST PIPES SAVES LIVES.

 

It may sound ridiculous & not realistic to write in on this request to re-write the laws against loud exhaust pipes but with the right justification with statistics of increased motorcycle accidents after the enforcement of loud pipes & expostulation it could be accomplished.

 

What we need is someone who is proficient in composing the memorandum to the Straits Times Forum with petitions from registered biker groups if better with backings from professionals in health care.

 

We could make it happen...

 

I guess u never live close to the junction and hence will never know how hard I have to try to sleep everynight..

 

Why? those 2 strokes bikers la. u know how irritating the sound is when they drag their gear so hard, trying to acclerate very fast in their lower gears and occasionally make those back-firing sound.

 

I agree with fila^11 that its the attitude of the road users that counts, So what if the drivers can hear the loud pipes sound,will that changed their bad driving habits?

 

Not to flame up with the rest, just my personal opinion, I think this request is ridiculous.

[Keynes]

When travelling, sound goes backwards, so loud pipes only alert the vehicle behind you (or besides, when you squeeze between cars), if you are approaching a car from its back, loud pipe doesn't really help the driver to notice you because when u move forward, sound travel backwards. Moreover, if he talks to someone, not concentrating or on loud music, he still cannot notice you. Only when he takes the trouble to check his rear view mirror or side mriror, and you switch on your headlights, then the chances are better. So, I don't thk loud pipes will help much in reducing m/cycle accidents rates. It will only create noise pollution and let the public have another excuse to condemn bikes and biking in general.

[mechwira]

perhaps u shd describe how a loud pipe 'saves lives' over and above ordinary pipes. contrary to wat u may think, the issue is not obvious.

 

i, for one, do not support the idea. in singapore i bet all of us lives close to a road. only the rich districts could possibly be 'ulu' enuff that there is no main road nearby. i feel that the increase in safety that a loud pipe offers is far too small to warrant giving up peace and quiet.

 

then again, i dun feel that a loud pipe helps at all. you have the horn for that. appealing to legalise air horns on bikes, now mebbe that one can consider. stock bike horns usually dam soft.

[sheep]

Wouldn't a loud horn be better? at least can horn those day dreamers.

loudpipes are simply a nusiance..

i am on a 2 stroker.. hehehe

[marzocchi]

my pipe (original hor) saved me from being hit when a car just reverse without checking behind inside a carpark. it's not even blind spot, i'm directly behind him! i rev once and he immediately jam brake. but it's a rare incident.

[mechwira]

Originally posted by marzocchi@Dec 22 2004, 08:46 PM

my pipe (original hor) saved me from being hit when a car just reverse without checking behind inside a carpark. it's not even blind spot, i'm directly behind him! i rev once and he immediately jam brake. but it's a rare incident.

for this kind of incident, the horn would have worked just as well. easier, in fact: a single press as compared to a prolonged twist.

[rickzhee]

Wondering where are all the guys who love to have custom fitted nice sounding LOUD exhaust pipes on their bikes....

[kohanson]

loud exhaust will cause noise polution.. imagine at night when you are sleeping, a bike with a very loud exhaust whack until red line.. i think you will be awaken by that..

[rickzhee]

Does the noise pollution caused justify the ten-fold increase fine from $50 to $500?

[mechwira]

Originally posted by rickzhee@Dec 23 2004, 11:58 AM

Does the noise pollution caused justify the ten-fold increase fine from $50 to $500?

interesting question. BUT i feel that amount of fine should be based FIRST on how much will effectively deter people from committing the offence, and SECOND on how serious the offence is. $50 is nothing to people really bent on modifying or changing pipes; its unlikely to be a deterrant. how high it should be, i'm not quite willing to say coz haven tot about it much.

[Guest nE0]

I think the authorities should focus on the intent of putting the pipes, rather than just shooting anyone who puts "loud pipes" on their bikes.

 

Two strokers already come stock with straight through exhausts, so they are pretty loud to begin with. But, some people go and remove the packing in the silencer unit, so the bike becomes unbearably loud and noisy, especially when the valve opens. The incredible noise is very disturbing, especially when the riders go dragging their bikes in the middle of the night, letting the "two stroke song" sing and echo around quiet housing estates while they "clear carbon"...

 

On the other hand, genuine bike enthusiasts who would want to bring out alittle more character from their bikes would look into installing some high quality slipon's or full systems to boost the engine's performance and get alittle more sound (music, for some of us) from the bike. No doubt this increase in noise levels would make the pipes illegal, but when used carefully and with consideration, there can be minimum impact on noise pollution. If the bike is not reved high, I'm sure the noise levels are perfectly acceptable.

 

Not to discriminate, but I see it with my own eyes, and hear it with my own ears. Some Harley riders love to go riding around town, blowing and blowing their bikes, letting the incredible unmuffled internal combustion engine supersonic sound waves out of their straight pipes in the wee hours of the morning. C'mon, this is un-nessesary.

 

I think we are civilised people, we can think, and we can ride with consideration. I've heard of storys of riders with modded pipes, pushing their bikes into carparks at late hours to avoid disturbing the residents. I've also heard of countless strokers dragging their bikes with open pipes just to irritate people.

 

So at the end of the day, we are still responsible for our actions. I think the tenfold increase in the penalty came about when increasing number of irresponsible people started going round pissing everyone off purposely with their noisy pipes.

[rickzhee]

Originally posted by nE0@Dec 23 2004, 02:56 PM

I think the authorities should focus on the intent of putting the pipes, rather than just shooting anyone who puts "loud pipes" on their bikes.

 

Two strokers already come stock with straight through exhausts, so they are pretty loud to begin with. But, some people go and remove the packing in the silencer unit, so the bike becomes unbearably loud and noisy, especially when the valve opens. The incredible noise is very disturbing, especially when the riders go dragging their bikes in the middle of the night, letting the "two stroke song" sing and echo around quiet housing estates while they "clear carbon"...

 

On the other hand, genuine bike enthusiasts who would want to bring out alittle more character from their bikes would look into installing some high quality slipon's or full systems to boost the engine's performance and get alittle more sound (music, for some of us) from the bike. No doubt this increase in noise levels would make the pipes illegal, but when used carefully and with consideration, there can be minimum impact on noise pollution. If the bike is not reved high, I'm sure the noise levels are perfectly acceptable.

 

Not to discriminate, but I see it with my own eyes, and hear it with my own ears. Some Harley riders love to go riding around town, blowing and blowing their bikes, letting the incredible unmuffled internal combustion engine supersonic sound waves out of their straight pipes in the wee hours of the morning. C'mon, this is un-nessesary.

 

I think we are civilised people, we can think, and we can ride with consideration. I've heard of storys of riders with modded pipes, pushing their bikes into carparks at late hours to avoid disturbing the residents. I've also heard of countless strokers dragging their bikes with open pipes just to irritate people.

 

So at the end of the day, we are still responsible for our actions. I think the tenfold increase in the penalty came about when increasing number of irresponsible people started going round pissing everyone off purposely with their noisy pipes.

Looks like we've got someone to write the letter to The Straits Times...

[mechwira]

Originally posted by nE0@Dec 23 2004, 02:56 PM

I think the authorities should focus on the intent of putting the pipes, rather than just shooting anyone who puts "loud pipes" on their bikes....

lemme noe if my opinion differs from your, coz this wat i think about the issue u bring up:

 

after-market pipes are all categorised into 2 types: road legal and race use only. the road legal pipes are almost always manufactured with consideration to laws regarding sound emission (among others). most notably, these pipes satisfy EU restrictions. hence, our authorities should consider legalising such pipes (considering only the issue of sound; they of coz use the generic excuse "more power means ur brakes cant handle"); since these pipes meet international restrictions on sound emissions and therefore will not significantly increase traffic sound levels. hence bike enthusiasts choosing to add more performance, or 'sweetening their bike sound', by using such road-legal pipes, should be allowed to do so.

 

on the other hand, bikers with the same intentions (of adding more power or 'changing the sound'), but do so by fitting non-legal pipes or by 'knocking' their pipes, should still be disallowed.

 

if this is in line wif your views, then i fully agree, coz considering only sound, the 'allowed' method above is real in the sense that doing so really wont significantly affect noise levels. but to completely do away with sound regulations, like the 'disallowed' method above, is not something i'd like to live with.

[Guest nE0]

Originally posted by rickzhee@Dec 23 2004, 04:58 PM

Looks like we've got someone to write the letter to The Straits Times...

That was a casual post, just speaking my mind.

 

 

Anyway, mechwira; It all boils down to the rider's intentions. If we behave in a civilised and considerate manner, then aftermarket pipes would not be so much of a problem. Imagine this; A Harley Davidson, rumbling down Orchard road, with some nice bassy Slipons. The rider just bumbles along at a leisure pace, the hearty V-twin can be felt on the pathment, ticking over at just above idle speed. Most people would turn and admire the bike rolling down the street.

 

Now picture this, another Harley, with straight through pipes with no resonators or mufflers, blowing every 2 seconds or so, backfiring every now and then due to the poor fuel mixture (on purpose), reving the bike on high gears just to hear the engine scream. The noise echos around the street, bouncing off buildings... You don't turn and admire the bike, you'd cover your ears in disgust!

 

There will be too much confusion and too many gray areas should certain categories of "road legal" aftermarket pipes be allowed. Right now there are a few brands and models specifically designed with the public's health in mind. Removable chamber pipes is a very good start. It allows reasonable improvement in the "quiet" mode, and the chamber can be quickly and easily removed for track use. For a start, maybe the authorities can look into an easier way to legalise pipes.

[BuZZBeaM]

Originally posted by nE0@Dec 23 2004, 02:56 PM

I think we are civilised people, we can think, and we can ride with consideration. I've heard of storys of riders with modded pipes, pushing their bikes into carparks at late hours to avoid disturbing the residents.

haha i happen to noe tis guy

ppl must be wondering how come his bike always "die" when coming to carpark

[mechwira]

Originally posted by nE0@Dec 24 2004, 04:59 AM

Anyway, mechwira; It all boils down to the rider's intentions. If we behave in a civilised and considerate manner, then aftermarket pipes would not be so much of a problem.

i agree wif this concept that you are saying. yet at the same time, surely you will also agree that wat u describe is idealistic rather than realistic. therefore, this idealistic case that u talk of should be used only in the context of coming up with a workable solution; wat i mean is, how do we tweak our regulations to achieve this idealistic state while still filtering out inconsiderate bikers who would abuse the freedom.

 

hence my opinions. allow the use of 'road-legal' pipes. there wouldn be much confusion, because its a simple matter of specifying which pipes/full systems are legal. in fact, i notice in adverts for pipes in foreign mags, the manufacturers specify which pipes are legal and which are race-use only. apply such a system, and the dealers would definitely know if the pipe they're selling is legal or not. this is, after all, the case in most countries like UK and US. no confusions there. those who persist in using illegal pipes there are not doing so out of ignorance, they just couldn give a dam.

 

i dun see how its possible to come up with a workable solution that is based on 'looking at ppl's intentions'. the pipe with removable baffles that you mention, for example: allow such pipes and what system is there to prevent abusers from removing the baffles entirely? if they dun do that, sure no prob, but thats not realistic isn it.

[marzocchi]

Originally posted by mechwira@Dec 22 2004, 09:13 PM

for this kind of incident, the horn would have worked just as well. easier, in fact: a single press as compared to a prolonged twist.

i don't have habit of using horn, why?

1) my bike doesn't have battery, so horn sometimes work, sometimes don't, even when it works, it's damn soft anyway.

2) when encounter danger, i rather avoid it by slowing down, accelerate or swerve(of cos muz be aware of surrounding) rather than horn and wait for others to notice my presence, to me it really makes hell lot of difference whether i will get into an accident or not. Some people just don't give a damn about us.

 

So my first reaction that day was to either blow or faster engage gear and go away from the car. Above are just my 2cents worth.

[mechwira]

Originally posted by marzocchi@Dec 24 2004, 07:38 PM

i don't have habit of using horn, why?

reason why was because i was trying to refer to topic. end of the day, which would we rather live with: bikes with louder pipes, or bikes with louder horns?

 

i wasn trying to say u were wrong to have done wat u did. of coz its better to avoid rather than wait for ppl to acknowledge you, as u said. therefore, instances where a horn wouldn have worked, unlikely loud pipes would succeed. hence referring to the topic, i dun see how loud pipes could be justified in instances where the horn would have worked just as well, if not better. not implying you, but a person pushing for a solution purely in the interest of safety wouldn go about with faulty horns then ask for loud pipes because 'it saves lives'.

[marzocchi]

Originally posted by mechwira@Dec 24 2004, 08:24 PM

reason why was because i was trying to refer to topic. end of the day, which would we rather live with: bikes with louder pipes, or bikes with louder horns?

 

i wasn trying to say u were wrong to have done wat u did. of coz its better to avoid rather than wait for ppl to acknowledge you, as u said. therefore, instances where a horn wouldn have worked, unlikely loud pipes would succeed. hence referring to the topic, i dun see how loud pipes could be justified in instances where the horn would have worked just as well, if not better. not implying you, but a person pushing for a solution purely in the interest of safety wouldn go about with faulty horns then ask for loud pipes because 'it saves lives'.

i truely understood what point you trying to get across. i too disagree with loud pipes, which is why i did not take out my diffuser purely because of sound. But for performance is another issue as mentioned by you earlier.

[Guest nE0]

Seriously, with all the sound absorbtion technology incoporated in today's modern luxury sedans and even family cars, much of outside noise is isolated from the interior of the vehicle itself. In this case, a distinct beep or hoot from a high quality pair of horns will do a much better job at warning others compared to loud pipes.

 

Note that I said pair. The human ear is better at picking out harmonics rather than a single note. Try listening to a Tuning fork, its a very pure note, hard to distinguish against background noise because its so pure. A good pair of horns are tuned in a clashed harmonic tone such that its distinctive, yet not shrill, irritating or shocking. Air horns on the other hand, some of them are very alarming in fact.

[maxbiaggi]

Originally posted by rickzhee@Dec 22 2004, 10:43 AM

Pertaining to the high motorcycle accident rates recently, we could use this hour to highlight to relevant authorities that IT IS A FACT THAT LOUD EXHAUST PIPES SAVES LIVES.

 

It may sound ridiculous & not realistic to write in on this request to re-write the laws against loud exhaust pipes but with the right justification with statistics of increased motorcycle accidents after the enforcement of loud pipes & expostulation it could be accomplished.

 

What we need is someone who is proficient in composing the memorandum to the Straits Times Forum with petitions from registered biker groups if better with backings from professionals in health care.

 

We could make it happen...

dun think will.dun think can.dun think would......................imagine like in malaysia

[Kira Yamato]

HARD to say lei....