Bikers Theological Discussion

[EddyMeng]

The creeds are old-fashioned.

All God's truth is ancient. C.H. Spurgeon said:

 

"There shall be no new God, nor new devil, nor shall we ever have a new saviour, nor a new atonement. Why then should we be attracted by the error and nonsense which everywhere plead for a hearing because they are new? To suppose the Theology can be new is to imagine that the Lord himself is of yesterday. A doctrine lately true must of necessity be false. Falsehood has no beard, but truth is hoary with age immeasurable. The old Gospel is the only Gospel. Pity is our only feeling toward those young preachers who cry: `See my new Theology!' in just the same spirit as little Mary says: `See my pretty new frock!'"

 

God's truth does not change any more than he can change. Paul said in Hebrews 13:8, "Jesus Christ the same yesterday, today and for ever." Spurgeon commenting on this verse said this.

 

There is no new God's truth ... we are only un-covering aka rediscovering HIS TRUTH

[x_00_x]

by Kenneth Copeland

 

And now I exhort you to be of good cheer.

 

– Acts 27:22

 

What do you do when you're in a really perilous situation?

 

If you're like I used to be, you cry out to God in desperation. One afternoon when I was squalling to God about something, He interrupted me and said, "Kenneth, did you know I don't hear the cry of My children when they cry out in desperation?"

 

"What?" I said. "I thought you did."

 

He said, "No, I hear the desperation cry of a sinner because that's all he can cry about. But once you get born again, son, you ought to be crying out of faith. I hear the faith cry."

 

What is a faith cry? It's calling things that be not as though they were (Rom. 4:17). It's what the Bible means when it says, "Let the weak say, I am strong" (Joel 3:10).

 

The Apostle Paul knew how to use the faith cry. That's why in Acts 27 he exhorted the men on that battered, sinking ship to "be of good cheer." He was telling them to start acting by faith. Can't you imagine what those sailors thought when he said that? "Listen to that stupid preacher. We're sinking and he says be of good cheer. We've thrown everything we have overboard and he says be of good cheer."

 

You may feel just like those sailors did, right now. You may feel like your ship's going down. You may feel like crying out in desperation. But don't do it. Instead, do what Paul said and be of good cheer!

 

Cry out to God in faith and say, "Lord, I'm not going to panic. I'm not going to despair. I'm going to be of good cheer because Your Word says You'll deliver me from this situation" (Ps. 34:19).

 

Then start being cheerful. It may take more determination than anything you've ever done before, but God will give you the strength to do it. He'll give you the power to be cheerful in the middle of the most ungodly darkness the devil can bring up.

 

Instead of crying out in desperation, take a faith stand. Sing and rejoice and praise God for your deliverance. Be of good cheer and you can be sure God will bring you through the storm just fine!

[EddyMeng]

“Rightly Dividing the Word of Truth” chart ... for your viewing

 

http://paulsgracemessage.org/rightly.htm

[EddyMeng]

Did the Lord sent fiery serpents in Num 21:6?

 

Pls note that how God treated His Children by the Abrahamic Covenant

Ex 13:21 The LORD was going before them in a pillar of cloud by day to lead them on the way, and in a pillar of fire by night to give them light, that they might travel by day and by night.

 

This reveals GOD’s heart for His Children

Which means God sheltered His Children from the scorching sun by a pillar of cloud by day.

And God gave His Children warmth from the cold desert in a pillar of fire by night to give them light too.

 

In modern day term:

God became the aircon for His Children in the day

God became the heater for His Children in the night

 

However, after Israel exchanged covenant … and when they are in Mosaic Covenant in Book of Numbers, after the 10 commandments, God had to honour their choice, God is also a just God:

Num 21:6 The LORD sent fiery serpents among the people and they bit the people, so that many people of Israel died.

 

One may think that God was the one that “sent fiery serpents” … this is half true.

Let me paint you a BIGGER picture … God actually shielded His Children from the Red Sea till Num 21:6 … which means there are serpents and scorpions in the desert.

 

When term “The Lord sent fiery serpents”, it is a permissive tense, which means God "lifted His hand of protection".

 

Hence, today you can choice to have a revelation of God’s goodness (His loving, kindness Hand of protection" as Jesus has already reconciled us to God.

 

In modern day term:

God don't send sickness and disease to His Children; because HE has none to give

God is constantly watching over us; because we are the apples of His Eyes

 

Or, you can have a “harsh father mentality” about God ... maybe like your army sergent officer

 

It’s your life … it’s your choice

 

to me Jesus is my ALL because God gave up HIS BEST for me

Edited April 20, 2010 by EddyMeng

[NinjaLite]

Eddy, but d second definition ..malady , refers to physical illness correct ?

 

the word "infirmities" here is

G769 ἀσθένεια astheneia (as-then'-ei-ah) n.

1. feebleness (of mind or body)

2. (by implication) malady

3. (morally) frailty

 

x_00_x , theological discussion , by tis definition...is a futile exercise in words....

Abt Gal 4:13-15 …. Read the following verse to see the context

Gal 4:16 Have I then become your enemy by telling the truth to you {and} dealing sincerely with you?

 

So, wats does 4:16 means in d context?? Isit able to disprove dat Paul's "illness"?

 

 

Mord, deduct half point for u ...... mentionin d***..... u hv ur belief.. eddy has his... as for Mi ?? I dun hav yet..dats y i am askin d question lah... bcos watever a pastor teaches on d pulpit.. if 1 thing is proven wrong...all his teachings / doctrines den also caqnt b trusted... but if its proven rite.. den 1 does indeed hav to change of heart and reali open up to his teachings.... thus, d question of whether Paul suffer from physical illness or jus a metaphor ..is of paramount importance

[x_00_x]

Eddy, but d second definition ..malady , refers to physical illness correct ?

 

the word "infirmities" here is

G769 ἀσθένεια astheneia (as-then'-ei-ah) n.

1. feebleness (of mind or body)

2. (by implication) malady

3. (morally) frailty

 

x_00_x , theological discussion , by tis definition...is a futile exercise in words....

Abt Gal 4:13-15 …. Read the following verse to see the context

Gal 4:16 Have I then become your enemy by telling the truth to you {and} dealing sincerely with you?

 

So, wats does 4:16 means in d context?? Isit able to disprove dat Paul's "illness"?

 

 

Mord, deduct half point for u ...... mentionin d***..... u hv ur belief.. eddy has his... as for Mi ?? I dun hav yet..dats y i am askin d question lah... bcos watever a pastor teaches on d pulpit.. if 1 thing is proven wrong...all his teachings / doctrines den also caqnt b trusted... but if its proven rite.. den 1 does indeed hav to change of heart and reali open up to his teachings.... thus, d question of whether Paul suffer from physical illness or jus a metaphor ..is of paramount importance

 

YK, did you conveniently miss out Paul was reffering to the 'truth' ? why not read the preceeding verses first before shooting your mouth again?

 

Since you are out more to proof that Paul was actually suffering from infirmities while writing to the Galatians or even when he wrote the letter to the Corinthians. Then let me pray for you to suffer the same fate as he does, who you be happy then?

 

God says He will bless you, come to give you abundance of life and prosperity in all areas. If you are so keen on your diseases prosper, I will pray for you to have it and have it more abundantly. Then at least finally you can tell yourself that your 'god' is like that.

 

What you believe of this Gospel is of paramount importance. Not whether Paul suffers any infirmities. Paul said those who desire to live godly in Christ Jesus will suffer persecution. If you fight for the Gospel, the devil will not let you go off easily. If you choose this truth, the world will come against you. If you make a mistake, you will suffer the consequences. There is no two ways about it. But like Paul have said, there are certain things God doesnt want him to do or go but he was too adamant about it and suffered. But God deliver him and still kept him alive for the furtherance of the Gospel.

 

i may sound harsh and heartless to you. but seriously you gotta wake up your idea and stop expecting 'all' christians to be nice and soft and whatever and to entertain your rhetorical questions. Its like drug addict reasoning his way out so that he can remain where he is and continue on his way.

[EddyMeng]

Eddy, but d second definition ..malady , refers to physical illness correct ?

 

the word "infirmities" here is

G769 ἀσθένεια astheneia (as-then'-ei-ah) n.

1. feebleness (of mind or body)

2. (by implication) malady

3. (morally) frailty

 

2. (by implication) malady

 

the word "malady" can mean disease or any desperate condition "a malady of the spirit" ... which Paul have to put up with ... Paul was ex-Saul who persecuted Christians and even consenting in stoning Stephen. Hence, now Paul has to face those whom he had been friends and buddies with. It is torturing for him to see his ex-friends and buddies to turn away from him and this to me is a "desperate condition" for Paul ... can also be called as " malady of the spirit"

 

in which i already posted quite a numerous points that Paul is NOT suffering from sickness ... because God don't send sickness and disease to His Children; because HE has none to give.

 

God dun give illness or disease to His Children, let alone ... Paul - THE Apostle that GOD handpicked out to spread the good news (Gospel) of God's grace

 

truth or tradition ... u choose what you like to believe lor

Edited April 20, 2010 by EddyMeng

[NinjaLite]

wahh...tis is theological discussion wor...not personal attacks leh

as stated. i m inviting both sides to state their verses and reasonings for supporting either sides of d views mah...

 

either u can answer my question...or dun answer... dun hav to divert attention to other things....

 

stick to d topic... " is paul suffering from physical illness or isit jus a metaphor"

 

hehe, tank goodness i dun hv Jenson Buttons for ppl to push....

 

 

Dun side track... answer leh... Gal 4:13-15 ... i dun hear a proper response yet...

[NinjaLite]

truth or tradition ... u choose what you like to believe lor

 

EddyM, for mi to choose... i must hav d proper facts de.. and hearing both sides of d view.. before i can decide wat to choose...

 

its making a informed decision... sori ah...

[EddyMeng]

wahh...tis is theological discussion wor...not personal attacks leh

as stated. i m inviting both sides to state their verses and reasonings for supporting either sides of d views mah...

 

either u can answer my question...or dun answer... dun hav to divert attention to other things....

 

stick to d topic... " is paul suffering from physical illness or isit jus a metaphor"

 

hehe, tank goodness i dun hv Jenson Buttons for ppl to push....

 

 

Dun side track... answer leh... Gal 4:13-15 ... i dun hear a proper response yet...

 

the answer is obvious

 

God dun give illness or disease to His Children, let alone ... Paul - THE Apostle that GOD handpicked out to spread the good news (Gospel) of God's grace

 

meaning Paul is NOT suffering from any physical illness

 

= Paul boh sick lah

 

Read Paul's hand, "handkerchiefs, towels or aprons" are filled of healing powers

Acts 19:11 And God did unusual {and} extraordinary miracles by the hands of Paul,

Acts 19:12 So that handkerchiefs {or} towels or aprons which had touched his skin were carried away {and} put upon the sick, and their diseases left them and the evil spirits came out of them.

 

Let's assume that Paul is ill ... all that Paul needs to do is use his own handkerchief and the illness have to leave in Jesus's name

 

For me the choice is beri clear

Edited April 20, 2010 by EddyMeng

[x_00_x]

wahh...tis is theological discussion wor...not personal attacks leh

as stated. i m inviting both sides to state their verses and reasonings for supporting either sides of d views mah...

 

either u can answer my question...or dun answer... dun hav to divert attention to other things....

 

stick to d topic... " is paul suffering from physical illness or isit jus a metaphor"

hehe, tank goodness i dun hv Jenson Buttons for ppl to push....

 

 

Dun side track... answer leh... Gal 4:13-15 ... i dun hear a proper response yet...

 

you believe what you want to believe. Its not a personal attack if you see it as a direct explanation.

 

Ppl tell you its not disease, gave you various Bible version of the same words. Gave you various explanation/commentary from other sources. And yet you are here to ask the same rhetorical question. If you have the audacity, speak up what you believe and stop inciting others to answer when you are not ready to receive. As said, answers are already given, its either you take it or leave it.

[EddyMeng]

you believe what you want to believe. Its not a personal attack if you see it as a direct explanation.

 

Ppl tell you its not disease, gave you various Bible version of the same words. Gave you various explanation/commentary from other sources. And yet you are here to ask the same rhetorical question. If you have the audacity, speak up what you believe and stop inciting others to answer when you are not ready to receive. As said, answers are already given, its either you take it or leave it.

dun so fierce lah ... relax lor

 

when someone ask hor ... then we can dig and rack our head a bit mah

[x_00_x]

dun so fierce lah ... relax lor

 

when someone ask hor ... then we can dig and rack our head a bit mah

 

not fierce, it may sound curt but being black or white is better than being grey sometimes. Anyway, here is an excerpt for all to read

 

 

http://catholic-resources.org/Bible/Paul-Galatians.htm#Introduction

 

An Outline of Paul's Letter to the Galatians:

 

1. Letter Opening (1:1-10)

1. Sender & Recipients: "Paul, an apostle... to the churches of Galatia:" (1:1-2)

2. Formulaic Greeting: "Grace to you and peace from God..." (1:3-5)

3. Excoriation & Rebuke, instead of the usual Thanksgiving (1:6-10)

 

2. Letter Body (1:11—6:10)

1. Paul's Autobiographical Defense of his Apostleship and his Preaching (1:11—2:21)

1. Paul's transition from persecuting the Church to preaching the Christian faith (1:11-24)

2. The Council of Jerusalem: Paul & companions discuss Gentile converts with the "pillars" of the Church (2:1-10)

3. The Incident at Antioch: Paul confronts Cephas/Peter about refusing to eat with Gentiles (2:11-14),

and argues that people are justified by the faith of Jesus, not works of the law (2:15-21)

2. Theological Deliberations: Arguments for Justification by Faith from the Galatians' Experience & the Scriptures (3:1—5:12)

1. The Galatians received the Spirit by believing in Christ, even before they knew about the law (3:1-5)

2. God's blessing of Abraham's faith is extended to all nations through Christ (3:6-14)

3. God's promises to Abraham, which came long before the law, are fulfilled in Christ;

the law was merely a "disciplinarian" until Christ came and brought faith (3:15-25)

4. All believers are adopted children and heirs of God, no longer slaves to “elemental spirits” of the world (3:26—4:11)

5. The Galatians should remember the devotion they had for Paul when he was first among them (4:12-20)

6. Abraham, Hagar, Sarah, and their two sons are an allegory for Christians as children of freedom, not slavery (4:21-31)

7. Concluding Application: Christ set us free, so Gentiles need not and should not be circumcised (5:1-12)

3. Ethical Admonitions: Freedom for Service, Life in the Spirit, and Sharing in Community (5:13—6:10)

1. Do not use freedom as an excuse for licentiousness, but for loving service (5:13-15)

2. Live by the Spirit, not the desires of the flesh (with lists of vices & virtues; 5:16-26)

3. Share with others and do good to all, especially to community of believers (6:1-10)

 

3. Letter Conclusion (6:11-18)

1. Personal Postscript, Summarizing Paul's Message (6:11-15)

2. Final Exhortation and Blessings (6:16-18)

 

[EddyMeng]

not fierce, it may sound curt but being black or white is better than being grey sometimes. Anyway, here is an excerpt for all to read

 

Rom 15:1 Now we that are strong ought to bear the infirmities of the weak, and not to please ourselves.

 

slowly slowly mah ... it took me about 5 years juz to unlearn my wrong teachings ... then now on the quest to learn and uncover more of HIS TRUTHS

 

Love is patient lor

[EddyMeng]

As the subject states: what do you think is the greatest sin in all the world?

 

anyone to start the ball rolling

[x_00_x]

Rom 15:1 Now we that are strong ought to bear the infirmities of the weak, and not to please ourselves.

 

slowly slowly mah ... it took me about 5 years juz to unlearn my wrong teachings ... then now on the quest to learn and uncover more of HIS TRUTHS

 

Love is patient lor

 

You go and do it lor since you interpret love and grace as such. No one is stopping you. Just make sure its not hypocrisy at the end of the day, cause it may do more damage to the ones you love.

[EddyMeng]

You go and do it lor since you interpret love and grace as such. No one is stopping you. Just make sure its not hypocrisy at the end of the day, cause it may do more damage to the ones you love.

 

k lor ... i understand slowness and when time permits ... i slowly slowly reply lor

 

hope no damage done

[EddyMeng]

Question 55

Which is the sixth commandment?

Answer 55

The sixth commandment is, "Thou shalt not kill."

 

that one hor, should be

 

Thou shalt not murder

 

if not hor, we cannot go and kill our enemies during war time hor ...

then will be like JW ... cannot carry any kind of weapon

[x_00_x]

that one hor, should be

 

Thou shalt not murder

 

if not hor, we cannot go and kill our enemies during war time hor ...

then will be like JW ... cannot carry any kind of weapon

 

and when mosquito bite you, must let it suck till its full. same goes for leeches.

[EddyMeng]

and when mosquito bite you, must let it suck till its full. same goes for leeches.

 

so those that obey "thou shall not kill" hor ... pls let the mosquito suck till its full

 

for me ... i will not hestiate to murder that mosquito or leeches

[EddyMeng]

[yt]www.youtube.com/watch?v=I6qhTjk35So[/yt]

[NinjaLite]

""why not read the preceeding verses first before shooting your mouth again? "" errr...doesnt tis sounds like personal attack??

 

 

but yes, Eddy did give various sources , and interepreations to substantiate d claim dat Pauls ailment is metaphorical...

 

but so does Mord... and his point dat Gal 4:13-15 states dat its physical ailness is a veri valid point dat cannot b lightly brush off....

 

so i m sincerely asking for explanations dat cld as u say put Gal 4:13-15 in a different context ..

 

wat u keep sayin is dat GOD does not gives illness to humans... but Paul is stil jus a human who could fall sick , dun he? he wasnt as yet a celestial being... and Paul is not Jesus , our perfect man...

 

so dats y i believe theological discussion here is needed to arrayed facts from both sides of the views... once all d cards are on d table.. i can clearly see who is rite and who is wrong.. its for my benefit and mine alone.. i m oni jus using experience from Mord n Eddy as a short cut to understand tis issue... dun ask me to read long long passages from various referneces la...

 

EddyM... a doctor mayb able to cure others..but not necesary himself..correct ?

[x_00_x]

""why not read the preceeding verses first before shooting your mouth again? "" errr...doesnt tis sounds like personal attack??

 

 

but yes, Eddy did give various sources , and interepreations to substantiate d claim dat Pauls ailment is metaphorical...

 

but so does Mord... and his point dat Gal 4:13-15 states dat its physical ailness is a veri valid point dat cannot b lightly brush off....

 

so i m sincerely asking for explanations dat cld as u say put Gal 4:13-15 in a different context ..

 

wat u keep sayin is dat GOD does not gives illness to humans... but Paul is stil jus a human who could fall sick , dun he? he wasnt as yet a celestial being... and Paul is not Jesus , our perfect man...

 

so dats y i believe theological discussion here is needed to arrayed facts from both sides of the views... once all d cards are on d table.. i can clearly see who is rite and who is wrong.. its for my benefit and mine alone.. i m oni jus using experience from Mord n Eddy as a short cut to understand tis issue... dun ask me to read long long passages from various referneces la...

 

EddyM... a doctor mayb able to cure others..but not necesary himself..correct ?

 

You should call it YK's personal edification thread then. And keep it private.

 

wat u keep sayin is dat GOD does not gives illness to humans... but Paul is stil jus a human who could fall sick , dun he? he wasnt as yet a celestial being... and Paul is not Jesus , our perfect man...

himself..correct ?

 

And why do you keep insisting that God gives illnesses? Are you so hard up for it? Then we can always pray for you to have it.

 

What ever the Father does, the Son do. Tell us now, did Jesus ever give anyone diseases or infirmities ?

 

At the cross, He completed the work and became the sacrifice once and for all. Something that the blood of bulls and goats can't take away. When you are cursed, only will you start to get the effect of it. Jesus was the one who satisfy what is written 'cursed is the man who was hung on a tree'.

 

You want to be cursed and be hung on a tree ? Then you can be the first LR martyr.

[EddyMeng]

EddyM... a doctor mayb able to cure others..but not necesary himself..correct ?

 

Acts 19:11 And God did unusual {and} extraordinary miracles by the hands of Paul,

 

Paul is more than a doc ... he is a supernatural healer

 

those healings, unusual extraordinary miracles were done thru Paul by the power of God.

 

The Ultimate Healer cannot heal his apostle ??? i cannot visualize that

[NinjaLite]

Do u fall sick? Or r u in perfect health now n forever ... haha ... dat wil answer ur own question....

 

oh yes..my own personal edification thread does sound like a good idea... at least its private btw mi, mord and eddy..wont hav someone come in and kaypoh kaychee...and put words in my mouth... esp when d person cldnt answer my question as yet... my youngest kid also do dat sometimes..cant answer den throw tantrums u know....

 

 

You should call it YK's personal edification thread then. And keep it private.

 

 

 

And why do you keep insisting that God gives illnesses? Are you so hard up for it? Then we can always pray for you to have it.

 

What ever the Father does, the Son do. Tell us now, did Jesus ever give anyone diseases or infirmities ?

 

At the cross, He completed the work and became the sacrifice once and for all. Something that the blood of bulls and goats can't take away. When you are cursed, only will you start to get the effect of it. Jesus was the one who satisfy what is written 'cursed is the man who was hung on a tree'.

 

You want to be cursed and be hung on a tree ? Then you can be the first LR martyr.