who doesn't squeeze in between cars while riding?

[Vashie]

Double post!

[Vashie]

I now internship at Funan/The Central, no choice but to buy train concession and squeeze with people.

Ride to intern takes too much time and $$ for parking.

 

Just a thought...don't you guys think that by lane splitting, aren't you guys entrusting part of your lives to other road users? Even to those reckless ones who don't check blind spots or signal before changing lane.

[haoKR]

I now internship at Funan/The Central, no choice but to buy train concession and squeeze with people.

Ride to intern takes too much time and $$ for parking.

 

Just a thought...don't you guys think that by lane splitting, aren't you guys entrusting part of your lives to other road users? Even to those reckless ones who don't check blind spots or signal before changing lane.

 

ya,thats y i sae is ****ing dangerous..omg

still cant believe i did that,v rush that day..

coz i didnt know 7pm will jam

 

times when there are jams like this, cars, lorries and trucks will change lanes very abruptly.

either u go to rain shelter and wait till traffic is smoother.

or u stick in between lane 1 and 2 and travel at ur comfort speed ( dun mind the tailgaters behind cos if they cannot tahan ur 'speed' they will switch lanes) and keep take a look out for cars who on-signal-and-switch-lanes at the same time( be it from the right or left)

 

but if late/v rush,how ?

haha

i plan earlier if i nid to go out in peak hr

[DeusExMachina]

or u stick in between lane 1 and 2 and travel at ur comfort speed ( dun mind the tailgaters behind cos if they cannot tahan ur 'speed' they will switch lanes)

 

If you have problems or are unable to keep up your pace while lanesplitting, then please either;

 

1) Split lanes 2/3 or 3/4.

2) Stay in lane with the cars

 

 

Don't be a roadhog and hold ppl up. Cos eventually, someone will run out of patience and cut you at a distance which you will find uncomfortable and you will end up here in this forum b1tching about some "reckless" rider who buzzed you.....

 

.... but you didn't realize why.

[Pandoras Kitten 3]

If you have problems or are unable to keep up your pace while lanesplitting, then please either;

 

1) Split lanes 2/3 or 3/4.

2) Stay in lane with the cars

 

 

Don't be a roadhog and hold ppl up. Cos eventually, someone will run out of patience and cut you at a distance which you will find uncomfortable and you will end up here in this forum b1tching about some "reckless" rider who buzzed you.....

 

.... but you didn't realize why.

 

 

Do we have to keep at this topic ?

 

Let's try to clear the air a bit - I didn't have time to attend to the obvious misunderstandings earlier because work and family was a deadlier menace. I assume we're all rational human beings who will work to get to the bottom of this issue.

 

The '*****ing and moaning' wasn't about me holding up anyone on the expressway by deliberately hogging Lane 2 at 60kph taking up all the space with my panniers.

 

I was more or less doing the usual "go slightly faster than traffic" routine until the end of the BKE before everyone had to slow down thanks to that little filter lane to the PIE (eastbound towards Adam Rd). I crawled along with the cars and was about one car length from the white chevron dividing the expressway from that point. The drivers are used to me doing that (my timing is identical each morning ) and don't try and force me to lanesplit. I follow you, you follow me, we all clear the congestion together.

 

When I saw our friend on the custom CB400 dash in from the right, I immediately flipped on the hazard lights and slowed down as gently as I could without causing the car behind to run me over.

 

If I were really a "big bike hater" my reactions to the Super Four making the last-second cut would definitely be different from hazard lights and slow speed balancing acts. I posted what I did anyway because human beings have feelings. I was forced to take evasive action and it took some emotional override to not hit the "horn" instead of "hazard lights and brakes".

 

More on my "reduced lanesplitting" methods later - I'm sorry @ohayo misunderstood my part about pointing out I had rode with a lot of homegrown non-lanesplitters - I am not an "anti lanesplitting" rider but will advocate riding between car lanes for certain scenarios. For the past few months I have been posting suggestions such as "reserve lanesplitting for emergency scenarios so you might conserve some energy for longer rides, or when you need quick reactions".

 

As @Vashie and others stated, definitely for the same reasons even on a cub, I try not to ride between car lanes all the time. It's all part and parcel of self-management, and what risk level am I willing to take spending years on end commuting to and from work. The less risk, the better, given the long term consequences of a serious motorcycle accident.

 

I'm not going to make this into one long all-encompassing essay so feel free to comment on part one of my response here. I look forward to your replies

[DeusExMachina]

No need to be defensive. I wasn't referring at you. If I was I would have quoted you.

I was referring to him/her. Holding up ppl behind is not wise. If you notice a line of bikes in your mirror, it's time to be automatic and move over.

 

 

That's all I'm trying to say.

 

 

But with regards to the topic, I think all this lane splitting, safety riding, talk... while useful.... has become bloated.

It's just a short commute to/from work and home, people. Not a Singapore to Phuket ride. All you need to do is use your common sense. Don't need to discuss theory until the cows come home.

[Vashie]

I guess in the end, it's all up to the rider to decide what works best for them.

All ways have it's pros and cons...what matters is we all reach home in one piece.

 

I don't have anything against lane splitters...except when they lane split or suddenly change lane and cut me at a very close range when there is totally no traffic at all!

[Pandoras Kitten 3]

But with regards to the topic, I think all this lane splitting, safety riding, talk... while useful.... has become bloated.

It's just a short commute to/from work and home, people. Not a Singapore to Phuket ride. All you need to do is use your common sense. Don't need to discuss theory until the cows come home.

 

Indeed, it's quite easy to just blast through the 15-30 mins commute and forget about it.

 

The little bit of theory can help the 'real' newbies though, as in new riders fresh out of riding school. It will at least caution them on what to look out for. Eventually, they'd have their own, hopefully safe riding style. It is good to be cautious at first.

 

But some have feedbacked that too-courteous riding invites danger in another way - as you have mentioned, the image of holding up traffic, and the classic "I'm between these two huge lorries waiting to be pancaked" situation.

 

A balanced stance would be optimal, but I wouldn't know what is balanced until I tried both ends.

[Pandoras Kitten 3]

I guess in the end, it's all up to the rider to decide what works best for them.

All ways have it's pros and cons...what matters is we all reach home in one piece.

 

I don't have anything against lane splitters...except when they lane split or suddenly change lane and cut me at a very close range when there is totally no traffic at all!

 

And you dare raise the same issue I did?

 

Seriously you can't prevent that since this is a non convoy situation and there is no mandatory "separation" between machines. However I experimented with low-speed coordination yesterday and today and found that you can let the other bike pass without hindering your and his/her progress much.

 

All it takes is to spot the other rider first, predict what he wants to do, shift left/right/front/back accordingly.

 

In this respect the bigger the other bike the easier you can coordinate. Those Malaysian cubs on the other hand have no qualm doing high-angle maneuvers right on your nose (it's just their style) so give them MORE room!

[barbaricboon]

I now internship at Funan/The Central, no choice but to buy train concession and squeeze with people.

Ride to intern takes too much time and $$ for parking.

 

Just a thought...don't you guys think that by lane splitting, aren't you guys entrusting part of your lives to other road users? Even to those reckless ones who don't check blind spots or signal before changing lane.

 

I also think so leh. But I just pass my TP not long ago so I cant comment much. Imho in reality we noe that alot of car drivers dont bother to check blind spot when changing lanes espcially during Jam. While Lanesplitting machaim like driving along the blindspot area of all the vehicles. The chances of accident increased substantially.

 

Before I passed my TP, I hav been driving for 10+yrs and 1 thing I hate is riders doing lanesplitting. One moment they are visible on my back mirror, the next moment, they are hidding in my blindspot. Only if u chk the blindspot fully( turn ur head over the shoulder) then u will realise that they are there cos they are so small compare to normal vehicle. Most drivers in Singapore do only 1/2 hearted blindspot chk or by using side mirror before changing lanes. which are not enough to spot a rider.

 

Another thing to take note is that different countries got different road driving/riding culture. for example: In vietnam, riders are the majority and cars need to giv way to them even if drivers got the right of way. Thai/Malaysia got more percentage of riders community so the drivers tend to be more aware of their presence on the road. In the states, the riders on the road behaves like a car. They seldom do lanesplit and occupies the same amount of "invisible space" as a car on the road. I still remembered that when i was driving in the states, I used singapore style of overtaking 3 cruiser riders on the road and they "followed" me all the way for 150miles, making abusive sign languages to me cos I "invaded" their "invisible space" by driving too near to them when overtaking which is the normal distance when in singapore.

 

Anyway, what i am trying to say is that in Singapore, the road conditions are more pro- drivers cos the riders community are small. The drivers are not "seasoned" like other countries(Thai/malaysia/Vietnam etc) to alter their driving behaviour to accomodate riders on the road. If really wan to lane split, sure go ahead, but pls be extra extra careful. Make sure u got lots of on the road experience.

 

Just a point to ponder. During my limited working experience of 10+yrs, I seldom late for work while driving. Since I can be punctual while driving , so can any riders.

So dont let time be ur rush factor to do lanesplit.

Cheers!

[Pandoras Kitten 3]

Thanks for the commentary from "the other side" @barbaricboon

 

As I spent most of my life in cars it has influenced my riding style appropriately albeit several years doing what you regard as 'normal' local riding. Eventually I felt riding in everyone's blind spots wasn't worth the risk so I planned ahead to minimise congestion.

 

Since I picked up motorcycle convoying skills I realised the key factor here is situational awareness and also more importantly, visibility. If I wore a reflective vest a car driver can spot me from a much further distance away thus increasing my safety bubble as well. In that respect, if I can work with car drivers like yourself to change lanes smoothly and help each other out on the road, this reduces dramatically my time spent between the lanes.

 

I've done approximately 16,000kms of this "cooperative" style now and I don't feel that anyone is out to run me off the road (not even the rushing taxi drivers). You got to look out for them and while sometimes mistakes are made (sometimes, bad ones), if you spot them first you just have to slow down a bit and let them catch up with the surrounding (traffic).

 

When in doubt of other vehicles' intentions simply hang back and get their attention. They will either allow the motorcycle to pass or block, in which case just decide on an alternative plan, such as wait and overtake safely.

 

Just try not to ride a black motorcycle in black garments - it's almost impossible to spot a "ninja" like that from the car view!

[ahcaibiker]

there is a major difference between lane splitting with care and lane splitting recklessly.

 

even if one stays in lane behind cars, there still is a real chance of becoming hamburger patty. you are the patty in between the bread which represent the cars/lorries/vans/trucks/pickups/anything that has 4 wheels or more. a squashed patty. i do not want to become one squashed squishy patty...

 

what is lane splitting with care and caution? you are always on the lookout of potential vehicles changing lane or suddenly swerving out. how to keep a lookout? glancing at the behavior of the vehicle's front wheel. it helps. staying out of blindspot area for more than 3 secs. not lanesplitting like the road belongs to your grandmama.

 

j-kups are one good example or reckless lanesplitting. i can go 'alamak' at the way they lanesplit...

[ohayo]

 

More on my "reduced lanesplitting" methods later - I'm sorry @ohayo misunderstood my part about pointing out I had rode with a lot of homegrown non-lanesplitters - I am not an "anti lanesplitting" rider but will advocate riding between car lanes for certain scenarios. For the past few months I have been posting suggestions such as "reserve lanesplitting for emergency scenarios so you might conserve some energy for longer rides, or when you need quick reactions".

 

 

 

Hmmmm....i cannot believe that there are riders in Singapore dont do lane split. Given the current traffic condition, its impossible. If there is a massive jam, these riders who dont lane split and stop and go with the cars? So far i have seen ZERO

 

I misunderstood your post? Wait a sec, Now your story changed? ohhhhh, bro/sis please dont pin the MESS on me. I aint misunderstood anything. Check my words bold with and yours now. If that is what you thought? Why in the first place, you said 'I GAVE A WRONG ANSWER?'

 

Dear Pandora's Kitten :3, all i can say is...During your relentless quest to promote your self composed and directed Pandora Kitten version of safety riding theory in this Singapore Bike Forum (cant say for your practical since i have not seen the real action), learnt to accept others. Do give your point of view only if YOU HAVE BEEN THERE AND DONE IT.

 

(1) For example, if you have not rode a class 2A and Class 2 bikes before, then do refrain from posting destructive comments. Instead of using strong words such as disgrace to put people down, perhaps you should look into other subtle ways to express your views across. In that particular thread, coming from my personal class 2 riding experience, i have already explained to you why bigger cc bikes cant really maintain slow speed like the 2B bikes. Unfortunately (maybe) you have not think over my reply deeply and adamantly blasted your comments particularly targeted at these group of riders. From the replies in this thread, perhaps you can read that there are other riders very unhappy of your unjustified comments

 

(2) Respecting other people point of view. By pointing the finger and tell the person 'YOU ARE WRONG' without any justification and without any concrete evidences is not the way to build up a foundation of well established communication network. Its a lot worse when one is just an empty shell who self proclaimed that I AM BETTER THAN EVERYONE ELSE HERE, THINGS SHOULD BE DONE "THIS" WAY BECAUSE I HAVE DONE SO.

 

(3) Peace out

[Aurium]

eh,

 

don talk don talk already!!!

TRIP ! TRIP ! TRIP !

lets all come out for a friendly meetup/discussion??

[Icomeforyou]

KK since both sides have both spoken, peace out peace out =)

 

@barbaricboon: Yeap, that's what is meant by planning I guess. If working at city and stay woodlands and drive, if you need to be there by 9, don't leave at 8.30 and say that there's a jam that's why you were late. Leave at 8, or 7:45 even and take your own time you will be able to make it in time (Not withholding accidents of course, but if there's accident, your boss will also be late, so don't worry)

 

Same for bikes, lane split is dangerous, we all know that. We (class 2b/2a/2) all also avoid lanesplitting when the roads are clear, so most importantly, lane split or not, ride safely, be considerate to other road users, and enjoy the ride.

 

Jia you to all ar, wednesday already, tomorrow last day and long weekend.

 

Avoid hatyai now flooded. =)

[kano]

chills bros. Ride safe and live another day. Life is short.

[ulysses_sc]

There is no need to disect each other's words just for the sake of rebuttal. Everyone has stated their views, and it is up to each individual to decide what is an acceptable level of risk.

 

Lane splitting is not exactly safe at the best of times. Just because there is no law banning it does not mean the space between lanes is a biker's highway.

 

Think there is enough discussion on this topic already. Our energies can be better used to rebutt some "Peter" character whose big anti-bikes message is publised in Straits Times (3 Nov) feedback section.

[Fried Rice]

if im late, i squeeze.

 

if not, i usually stay behind.

[kmax]

times when there are jams like this, cars, lorries and trucks will change lanes very abruptly.

either u go to rain shelter and wait till traffic is smoother.

or u stick in between lane 1 and 2 and travel at ur comfort speed ( dun mind the tailgaters behind cos if they cannot tahan ur 'speed' they will switch lanes) and keep take a look out for cars who on-signal-and-switch-lanes at the same time( be it from the right or left)

 

typical ah pek attitude that i meet everyday

 

are you really riding DRZ as your nick ?

[kmax]

I also think so leh. But I just pass my TP not long ago so I cant comment much. Imho in reality we noe that alot of car drivers dont bother to check blind spot when changing lanes espcially during Jam. While Lanesplitting machaim like driving along the blindspot area of all the vehicles. The chances of accident increased substantially.

 

Before I passed my TP, I hav been driving for 10+yrs and 1 thing I hate is riders doing lanesplitting. One moment they are visible on my back mirror, the next moment, they are hidding in my blindspot. Only if u chk the blindspot fully( turn ur head over the shoulder) then u will realise that they are there cos they are so small compare to normal vehicle. Most drivers in Singapore do only 1/2 hearted blindspot chk or by using side mirror before changing lanes. which are not enough to spot a rider.

 

Another thing to take note is that different countries got different road driving/riding culture. for example: In vietnam, riders are the majority and cars need to giv way to them even if drivers got the right of way. Thai/Malaysia got more percentage of riders community so the drivers tend to be more aware of their presence on the road. In the states, the riders on the road behaves like a car. They seldom do lanesplit and occupies the same amount of "invisible space" as a car on the road. I still remembered that when i was driving in the states, I used singapore style of overtaking 3 cruiser riders on the road and they "followed" me all the way for 150miles, making abusive sign languages to me cos I "invaded" their "invisible space" by driving too near to them when overtaking which is the normal distance when in singapore.

 

Anyway, what i am trying to say is that in Singapore, the road conditions are more pro- drivers cos the riders community are small. The drivers are not "seasoned" like other countries(Thai/malaysia/Vietnam etc) to alter their driving behaviour to accomodate riders on the road. If really wan to lane split, sure go ahead, but pls be extra extra careful. Make sure u got lots of on the road experience.

 

Just a point to ponder. During my limited working experience of 10+yrs, I seldom late for work while driving. Since I can be punctual while driving , so can any riders.

So dont let time be ur rush factor to do lanesplit.

Cheers!

 

sorry.. next time i'll try to overtake faster so i wont be in ur blindspot

 

it's not rush.. it's more fun..

[Shana_Gabz]

typical ah pek attitude that i meet everyday

 

are you really riding DRZ as your nick ?

 

well it may be typical or ill mannered to hog during such times like this, but really its better than compromising ur own safety right in order to allow that bugger behind u to overtake?

 

in my own experience, if i really need to overtake during such situations, i wont kaciao the guy infront or tailgate too closely, just wait for an opportunity to slip to inbetween 2 and 3 and then go way further before returning to between 1 & 2. (do take cautious when doing this, lest i want someone to follow me and ended up on the other side)

 

kmax: well im abt to change the nick. abit malu. in case next time change ducati still under DRZ nick ^_^

[kmax]

eh,

 

don talk don talk already!!!

TRIP ! TRIP ! TRIP !

lets all come out for a friendly meetup/discussion??

 

yeah.. too bad we all are stuck at school/office.. so no choice kpkb on SBF... hahaha

[kmax]

well it may be typical or ill mannered to hog during such times like this, but really its better than compromising ur own safety right in order to allow that bugger behind u to overtake?

 

in my own experience, if i really need to overtake during such situations, i wont kaciao the guy infront or tailgate too closely, just wait for an opportunity to slip to inbetween 2 and 3 and then go way further before returning to between 1 & 2. (do take cautious when doing this, lest i want someone to follow me and ended up on the other side)

 

kmax: well im abt to change the nick. abit malu. in case next time change ducati still under DRZ nick ^_^

 

yeah man.. coz DRZ are the one always tailgate me on CTE.. hahaha

 

live and let live.. if i can squeeze.. i squeeze.. if someone faster come from behind, i'll slip into cars and let them go, if someone road hog (at decent speed, i'll follow) if too slow.. then

[DeusExMachina]

well it may be typical or ill mannered to hog during such times like this, but really its better than compromising ur own safety right in order to allow that bugger behind u to overtake?

 

in my own experience, if i really need to overtake during such situations, i wont kaciao the guy infront or tailgate too closely, just wait for an opportunity to slip to inbetween 2 and 3 and then go way further before returning to between 1 & 2. (do take cautious when doing this, lest i want someone to follow me and ended up on the other side)

 

kmax: well im abt to change the nick. abit malu. in case next time change ducati still under DRZ nick ^_^

 

 

It's inconvenient for other riders to jump from 1/2 to 2/3. You're making them cross lane, lane split, then cross lane back again. And they still have to check behind to see that no one (you) is coming up from behind before merging back in to 1/2.

 

If you think you can't handle 1/2, please use 2/3 or 3/4. Save everyone else the trouble.

[scubasimon]

Treat it like your private parts. Don't flaunt it or let it hang out in public. Keep it to yourself.

 

hehehehe...SOLID!!!