needed some advice, my friend just passed away from bike accident.

[haowei]

peeps, isn't truth is the rider passed away in a bike accident incident. the bike is consider fully paid?? or still have to continue pay for the bike installment. need some pro to clarity this, due to his family already have some financial problem. the bike will become a burden if have to continue paying. the forensics have tested in under the condition of drink driving. so i doubt the insurance can come in any useful way. thanks for any comments.

[GuiNNeSS]

1) He died due to his own drink riding, or someone else's drink driving?

 

2) And no. Its not considered fully paid. And this is a matter to be sorted thru by the lawyers and the bike loan people. The family dont have to pay anything, until this is sorted out. Was there a garantor? Do advise the garantor to discuss options in tandem with the family and the lawyer.

 

3) Was the bike beyond salvation?

[haowei]

1) He died due to his own drink riding, or someone else's drink driving?

 

2) And no. Its not considered fully paid. And this is a matter to be sorted thru by the lawyers and the bike loan people. The family dont have to pay anything, until this is sorted out. Was there a garantor? Do advise the garantor to discuss options in tandem with the family and the lawyer.

 

3) Was the bike beyond salvation?

 

 

 

1) yes he crash due to drinking.

2) not sure whether insurance can claim.

3) he riding grxr1000, crash at cornering. bike hit to side of the kerb, head fairing whole piece came out. not sure whether still can start engine. bike still at tp hq.

[GuiNNeSS]

There really isnt much to do.

 

This really is a matter of the family lawyer and the family members. Plus and minus a few extra persons that has financial entanglements with the deceased.

 

Leave the bike at TPHQ until the person handling the deceased's estate is named. Probably later tow it out, repair or scrapped the bike and add that to the remaining estate/debt of the deceased to be distributed out. Until then, just write a short note, fax the death cert to the bike shop/finance companies/insurance companies/schools & work place to let them do their administration, and work out from there.

 

Insurance payouts is dependant on some issues, so you can only advise the family to hope for the least. If there is payouts, treat as a bonus.

[arthur_chan]

sadly to say the deceased's debts have to be passed on. thus unless the successor of the deceased's debt/inheritance declares bankrupt, he will need to clear the debts.

 

peace for the deceased

[tingchiyen]

sadly to say the deceased's debts have to be passed on. thus unless the successor of the deceased's debt/inheritance declares bankrupt, he will need to clear the debts.

 

peace for the deceased

 

That is not correct. The debts of the deceased are personal obligations of the deceased and limited only to the assets of his Estate. They do not pass on to his next-of-kin, dependants, beneficiaries etc. as personal obligations unless there is a personal guarantee involved.

 

TS, assuming that your friend did not have a Will and his Estate is valued under S$50,000, his family can apply to the Public Trustee to administer his Estate. You can refer to the process here: http://app2.ipto.gov.sg/IPTOServices/PublicTrustee/AdministrationofSmallEstatesoftheDeceased/tabid/381/Default.aspx

[haowei]

That is not correct. The debts of the deceased are personal obligations of the deceased and limited only to the assets of his Estate. They do not pass on to his next-of-kin, dependants, beneficiaries etc. as personal obligations unless there is a personal guarantee involved.

 

TS, assuming that your friend did not have a Will and his Estate is valued under S$50,000, his family can apply to the Public Trustee to administer his Estate. You can refer to the process here: http://app2.ipto.gov.sg/IPTOServices/PublicTrustee/AdministrationofSmallEstatesoftheDeceased/tabid/381/Default.aspx

 

dude you got apply this grant before?

[GuiNNeSS]

dude you got apply this grant before?

 

Maybe ask around. Others went thru this kind of stuff.

Edited February 7, 2011 by ViciousKitty74

[haowei]

that why i seek help from forum peeps... any kind of info will be good for my friend family.

[tingchiyen]

dude you got apply this grant before?

 

No. The IPTO website is fairly self-explanatory though and full of FAQs.

[ChaoPuzzy1968]

get a lawyer first

 

Division 4 — Cessation of debt repayment scheme

 

ref http://statutes.agc.gov.sg/non_version/cgi-bin/DisplayContent.pl?DOCID=2009-REVED-20&VID=1257319084-001487&WEF=latest&TYPE=simple&mode=and&version=currentVersion&query1=death%20debt

 

Cessation of debt repayment scheme

56K. —(1) A debt repayment scheme applicable to a debtor shall cease —

(a) on the date a certificate of inapplicability of the scheme is issued under section 56L;

(b) on the date a certificate of failure of the scheme is issued under section 56M(1);

© on the date a certificate of completion of the scheme is issued under section 56N(1), notwithstanding any subsequent revocation of the certificate under section 56O(1);

(d) upon the debtor being adjudged a bankrupt under this Act; or

(e) upon the death of the debtor,

whichever first occurs.

[6/2009]

(2) Upon the cessation of a debt repayment scheme, the debt repayment plan under the scheme shall cease to have effect.

[6/2009]

 

 

but hor if the garantor is alive....then the garantor kenna lor

Edited February 7, 2011 by ChaoPuzzy1968

[arthur_chan]

that's why i said, there's no way to escape a debt. there will always be a successor. a valuation of estate can also come to a negative value n pass on according to will. not to mention lawsuit from the other party in this case.

 

thus unless a loan has no gurantor, he did not state a will n nobody claimed his will, his assets will be confiscated n disposed by bank whichever way the deem fit.

 

not to rub salt on wound, but the family members has to be prepared for what's coming. consulting a lawyer is the best.

[contrarian]

that's why i said, there's no way to escape a debt. there will always be a successor. a valuation of estate can also come to a negative value n pass on according to will.

 

I will be the second person here to say that you are wrong, again.

 

This is a serious matter and others may follow your opinion to their own disadvantage. If you do not know the subject well enough, then do not mislead others.

 

Mr Ting knows his law and I will support the views he has expressed earlier.

 

A debt on a deceased person can only be claimed against the estate and is limited to the assets of the estate. If you owe one million but only have $1 in your estate, the claimants can claim one million but will only get $1.

Even if if you bequeath a specific item to your beneficiary, the beneficiary can renounce the right to it - so no beneficiary in his right mind will accept a "negative value".

[arthur_chan]

i've already said, if the loan has no gurantor. however how many type of loans can u state that falls into this category? thus unless the loan was signed ONLY by the deceased, then the claimants can only claim his estate, which in terms estate is the general term "successor".

 

as sucessor of a debts meaning a gurantor, joint account, etc, the creditors can claim the other named party instead of the deceased.

 

in the case of a property loan, like TS's friend's case, gurantor will be next in line, followed by estate and/or confiscate property. however finer details need to be looked into. thus u see the "successor"? tingchiyen did state what i mentioned to be true if u read the whole paragraph, not just context.

 

if there was a named will, a negative valued estate MIGHT be passed on, depends how the lawyer fights it and the content of the will. and there might be other loans/debts with other complications which we are not in position to advise without details.

 

thus a debt might not fully resolve upon death, a lot of details needs to be look into, and passing on to lawyer for consultation will be a better position. a fixed law doesnt mean creditor dont have other means, it all depend on the contract. if it is so easily to resolve a debt, i would have paid a sum to get a dying old man to sign for a huge loan.

 

i do admit i'm not a lawyer nor i know my law fully, but the general context for general cases is true. a creditor will be unlikely to close account of a debt upon death of debtor, unless he got no other choice. family or relative might be implicated too. i know this cos my father got involved into a debt situation, where he wasn't the person who signed the loan.

[swoosh]

peeps, isn't truth is the rider passed away in a bike accident incident. the bike is consider fully paid?? or still have to continue pay for the bike installment. need some pro to clarity this, due to his family already have some financial problem. the bike will become a burden if have to continue paying. the forensics have tested in under the condition of drink driving. so i doubt the insurance can come in any useful way. thanks for any comments.

 

Guarantor will be responsible if there is one, bike shop will follow up the matter with him/her. No legal obligation for family members to settle the loan. Hope he has bought some basic life insurance e.g CPF dependant protection scheme to help his family . May his soul rest in peace.

[couscous.falafel]

Bro try get the insurance document and read/comprehend fully. Then can see if got loophole to exploit etc.

 

I was thinking, if insurance covers death even thru drink riding, and cover market value at time of loss, then the remaining amt of the loan wld be lesser.

[contrarian]

as sucessor of a debts meaning a gurantor, joint account, etc, the creditors can claim the other named party instead of the deceased.

 

If you are in the business of enforcing debt and security, you may know how a lender would act to recover - which seems to be what you are describing. But that is not the same as the action against the borrower.

 

Your words just showed that you don't even know the difference between the law of succession and the law of guarantees. You think that the guarantor is the successor just because the lender has recourse against another party, the guarantor? An action against a guarantor is different from an action against an estate. Just because a lender has two separate courses of action does not make the guarantor the same as a successor.

 

As you have conceded that you're not a lawyer and don't know the law fully, I shall say no more on this matter.

[arthur_chan]

does anyone know what contract the deceased has signed?

 

a loan doesn't necessary mean there's a gurantor. if something were to happen to the gurantor, then there's no gurantor to claim. or perhaps the contract states of another property in case of non-payment.

 

if "successor" isn't a suitable word, kindly advise a replacement. i meant it as a general term without knowing any details. the possiblities of this scenerio is endless.