[Archived - 2009] PK Official- Questions for Newbie

[mepkoh]

yea thats right! fling like no tomorrow chain lubes for the win!

 

my FC is about 30km/l... but running lean means that you are going to get a green exhaust pipe...

 

ya..a green bike....end up with hole in piston and pocket.

[mepkoh]

Anyone knows why my fc only can rover around 32-34? Im 75kg btw with a rear box and saddles. Low rev most of e time. Chong doesnt seem too good with tuning and i wish mepkoh would be more detailed with e tuning for diyers.

 

 

Tuning??? what u want to achieve??

good FC= slow machine

fast machine= bad FC

 

the above is very genralistic view...but tuning is more thant that..

 

the various jets in the carb setting are just a means to get what u need..but there is a limitation to every thing..ie.it is a just impossible to achieve the following..

good fc, good pick up, strong torque through out the rpm range, high top speed...etc..

thus a compromise and choices are made as to what is the most important characteristic u want.

 

Chuan.z. is right ..a dyno test will visually show how your bike perform after each tune...and retunes and tests to achieve/comfirm what u set out to do.

and it is expensive to do..

 

as our bike is a normal avergy bike ...where performance is more tune to good FC...than adjusting the Fuel mixture jet is the one i would do..

but becareful not to get it too lean.....or u end up with other problems.

of course good fc at the expense of bike speed/performance.

 

the easiet way is to change the gearing of the drive sprockets ..ie higher gear ratios will definely gives u better FC..but sluggish pickup..ur choice.

 

any way ..your FC is not too bad...i have seen worse. also take note of the load on the bike it is approaching the spec limit of 12o kg.

[jB]

Dear mepkoh,

 

You're experience quite good FC considering you have a rear box and 2 extra laden weights by your side; saddle bags. The last time I bothered to check my FC for the phantom a year ago was around yours but I only had a rear box the most and a 70kg rider.

 

Tuning doesn't necessary mean "good fc = slow machine" and "fast machine = bad fc". Chong also tunes by feeling and feelings also changes over time. He might tune fast pickup for you or better top end and it may differ to your style of liking, so can't really remark that his tuning ain't good unless you've informed him beforehand what you wanted.

 

Furthermore, you can have "good FC" and "good pickup" if you get the correct tuning, something like in the middle of both settings. The mid of power bend to average things out. But you might get average pickup(in your opinion) and average top end. I reckon tuning a carb is a trial and error thing. Other than that, I think its a waste of time if you want good "power to weight" ratio for this bike. For anything else, there's the kups which can do as well or even better the bike you're struggling with.

 

No offence meant, enjoy the weekend

[mepkoh]

how to tune carb to give...

good FC, good pick up, good top speed???

 

yeah there is alot of choices...thats what they are.

anyway just responding to Hydher queries on FC and tuning...like everything there must be a base line to compare with...I base the comparison with the stock/manufacturer settings.

for phantom and alot of bikes the best is to stick with the mfg settings...our bikes is too small in terms of power to really see a appreciable increase of this or that...IMHO

 

anyway i use to ride TA150...my FC is 20km/L....thats averagy for that bike...nothing special (that is only when i ride with extreme lightness of feet and hands )....if not the Fc can go down to 15km/L..

[mepkoh]

some bikes are tune for;

fc= normal riding ...the whole range

torque= scramblers..2000 to 4000 rpm

speed= drag bikes....nothing less than 4000 rpm?

 

can our carb do that?

carbs are made differently to achieve the desired outcome.

 

for those who want to change carb for their bike only do so in the presence/aid of experts..or else most likely ur ride would be worse than u started with.

[Smart Bet]

Well, carbs can do that, to a certain extent but it involves changing components. And obviously, this is very unlike EFI bikes where settings can be mapped electronically with high accuracy.

 

Tuning is not a mysterious art. It is pure science between machine and rider. Even if Rider A has good FC due to tuning, doesn't equal to rider B using A's bike.

 

I agree with mepkoh on going back to the baseline and manufacturer's settings. And then fine your optimum (be it FC or performance) from there. If I'm not wrong (sorry, I last rode a TA about 5yrs ago), the default is 1 and 3/4 anti-clockwise from a fully closed jetting needle.

[Hydher]

thank you. rather true. last time tuned with ah chong coz of back fires after he changed my air valve. next time can perhaps see as he tune after he changes my spark plug and ask him to teach abit. but afraid might lead to complications.. mepkoh, take out spark plug when hot to check?

[jtzx]

GT85 strips the old lube, same category as your "chapter 2 cycle" or kerosene ah, dun mix up leh. After applying GT85, need to wash it off and apply proper lube/wax.

 

 

gp1 is a lub??

 

sorry man. cause in cyclist term, GT85 is a good lub for your chain and chainrings ;-)

[jtzx]

Without proper dyno, tuning becomes an art (or "agaration", if you will). No choice but to based on experience, which brings up the question of consistency and personal preference. Try making minute adjustment to the A/F ratio and use your butt dyno to tell.

 

Cannot really blame Chong or whoever that tunes based on listening to the idling beat only. For proper tuning based on "feel", you need to make the changes, ride around to feel the bike response, come back make adjustment, and go ride around again to see if the change is positive or negative, then make subsequent adjustment, and repeat until you get the "most correct" feel. Since bike shop tune by feel for free, cannot expect them to spend like 30 mins just to get the best setting for you lor.

 

For me, after getting Ah Chong to set the carb, I use that as a baseline. Riding back home, already got the initial feel. As I ride to work everyday, usually will make adjustment before riding to office, take note of changes/effect, then make adjustment before riding home, etc. Whole process actually spreaded out across many days! Hehe.

 

 

dun really get what u guys meant. talking about the idle knob for the engine? tuning that thing?

[Hydher]

Without proper dyno, tuning becomes an art (or "agaration", if you will). No choice but to based on experience, which brings up the question of consistency and personal preference. Try making minute adjustment to the A/F ratio and use your butt dyno to tell.

 

Cannot really blame Chong or whoever that tunes based on listening to the idling beat only. For proper tuning based on "feel", you need to make the changes, ride around to feel the bike response, come back make adjustment, and go ride around again to see if the change is positive or negative, then make subsequent adjustment, and repeat until you get the "most correct" feel. Since bike shop tune by feel for free, cannot expect them to spend like 30 mins just to get the best setting for you lor.

 

For me, after getting Ah Chong to set the carb, I use that as a baseline. Riding back home, already got the initial feel. As I ride to work everyday, usually will make adjustment before riding to office, take note of changes/effect, then make adjustment before riding home, etc. Whole process actually spreaded out across many days! Hehe.

 

gp1 is a lub??

 

sorry man. cause in cyclist term, GT85 is a good lub for your chain and chainrings ;-)

 

Yes. Gp1 is a lube. Bro, dun compare like that. One is a machine with an engine capable of going over 100km/hr. We need better lubrication for heavier machineries. Gt85 is too thin.

 

dun really get what u guys meant. talking about the idle knob for the engine? tuning that thing?

 

Nope, its a different tuning. air, fuel ratio.. more complexed.

[mepkoh]

thank you. rather true. last time tuned with ah chong coz of back fires after he changed my air valve. next time can perhaps see as he tune after he changes my spark plug and ask him to teach abit. but afraid might lead to complications.. mepkoh, take out spark plug when hot to check?

 

 

check when it is save to check...thats why sometimes a simple job takes hours for a simple reason .. just waiting time for bike to cool down...

it is not advisable to change immediately after aride..eg, spark plugs, eo..etc..but becaus of time pressure the workshop do it...in time the threads will wear out faster...IMHO

[hamsterwhale]

GT85 is a degreaser and also a water displacer, once u let it dry, ur chain will be exposed w/o protection from the elements, lubing a chain is not getting the chain all oiled and greased, its to let the oil penetrate the o-ring/link so as to prevent it from overheating, and let the fine debris to accumulate it inside the ring/link which will cause it to wear out prematurely....

 

carb tuning should be done this way, ride the bike after tuning to assess whether its up to your specification or demand, and fine tune it from there...even with a proper Dyno on hand, u need to tune at least 3-4times to get the desired result, whats more with a trial and error method on carbs...

 

if a F1 car can juz go and race w/o countless of R & D coupled with countless testing...i think it would be juz a normal automotive sport with no big time sponsors involved...

 

Cheers!

[chuan.z]

gp1 is a lub??

 

sorry man. cause in cyclist term, GT85 is a good lub for your chain and chainrings ;-)

 

Yes. Gp1 is a lube. Bro, dun compare like that. One is a machine with an engine capable of going over 100km/hr. We need better lubrication for heavier machineries. Gt85 is too thin.

 

Right-o. GT85 might be sufficient for bicycle chain, but it won't do for your motorcycle chain. For lubing the motorcycle chain, some people use EO, some use chain wax/lube.

Personally, I'm on Maxima chain wax (the gold spray can). It doesn't fling and that keeps me happy during bike wash

[VidaK]

I like fling like no tml chain lubes... if after riding I notice that my rims/chain guard is too clean, then I know its time for lubing!

 

phantom: Yay!

[chuan.z]

I like fling like no tml chain lubes... if after riding I notice that my rims/chain guard is too clean, then I know its time for lubing!

 

phantom: Yay!

 

I was OK with it too, until one fine day after lubing, the fling kena my gf's clothes (one or two "dots"), and a few "dots" on the rear signal chrome "railings". That's when I knew that the fling has to go. And then I got addicted on no fling lube

[VidaK]

my rear signals are shifted to the license plate and my sideboxes tanking flings towards the pillion ^^

[sh3rman]

was wondering how long do the batteries on the phantom last.

[Finrod]

Batteries generally last 2 yrs....

[Finrod]

Btw to add on, FC of 35km/l is good already. To get mebbe ard 40km/l u might need to ride conservatively, change gears with momentum and ensure that chains, tyre pressure and etc all in "good condition". 35km/l is very good already bro. Unlike my vara which is 25km/l. Im feeling the difference now in terms of petrol $$....khkhakhaka

[jtzx]

yup.. finally i got my Fc latest of 38km/L..

 

chains everyhow long do you check???

 

tyre pressure every 2-3 days?

[Hydher]

Air filter can use vacuum cleaner to clean? or must use air gun?

[VidaK]

yup.. finally i got my Fc latest of 38km/L..

 

chains everyhow long do you check???

 

tyre pressure every 2-3 days?

 

chains: lube every 500km! while lubing check the distance of freeplay... about 1 inch is good... too much need to tighten...

 

tyre pressure... you can just check at the petrol station whenever you pump petrol... I guess...

[jtzx]

chains: lube every 500km! while lubing check the distance of freeplay... about 1 inch is good... too much need to tighten...

 

tyre pressure... you can just check at the petrol station whenever you pump petrol... I guess...

 

okay.. the tyres pressure and lub is a easy task.. But bout the freeplay thingy how to see ? i know how to tighten it from the owners manual...

[VidaK]

okay.. the tyres pressure and lub is a easy task.. But bout the freeplay thingy how to see ? i know how to tighten it from the owners manual...

 

oh... ha just move the center of the chain up and down! but do use something or else your hand is gonna be black... and you can't really wash it off lol!

[jtzx]

okay... will do. thanks once again =p