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Do you know how to break in your new Bike (Engine)


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Originally posted by Phryford@Jan 13 2006, 01:37 AM

THis has been a very hot argumentative topic....hm...

Hard Run???

or

Soft Run???

Both seemed balanced wif pro's and Con's...

To each his own lah Phryford. Just go with what you think is best... :goodluck:

First learn stand, then learn fly. Nature's rules biker-sans. Not mine...

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May 98 - Oct 05 : GSX R400R FN3306D

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Originally posted by WW@Jan 12 2006, 10:55 PM

And maybe to those other biker, can read up other bike fourms . like gixxer.com or the R1 forum in the US. 80% of the biker would recommend the hard run in, and i guess that 80% are all not stupid biker ba. And no one say the soft run in is bad. the hard run in help you save time.

Hey come on lah WW, I find you ah... very Hand gun... Always wanna act big brother. Then act humble but feels so shiok when pple put you high. When someone points out your mistake you cannot stand it and wanna prove him wrong. Unity sure has a way to hold your nose and turn around. C'mon lah... Dun mislead the newbies lah... You go and take 2 brand new bikes run in them one with the manufacturer specs and one in your "WW endorsed way". Both bikes will be powerful within the first 2 or 3 thousand km. And Running in is not the only factor that affects the engine power. There're many other things like choice of Engine oil, maintenance, your gearbox condition, clutch condition etc. If both maintain the same way, You strip both engines after 30000KM and see the difference. Excel cycles took over some famous hard run in engines from famous people. The mechanic down there curse and swear. That engine was a time bomb. There's a hayabusa in a very bad condition there now. Go there take a look. Go and overhaul engines.... Then you will know why the manufacturers have to recommend their way of running in. You dun even know how an engine's fundamentals works and kept spreading wrong info.

 

Enfant said it in a very blunt way. But what he said is what the automotive personnel say it. I know him personally and he works closely with the automotive clients. You keep going into forums after forums all old wives tales but never check with the agents or the manufacturers or real life professionals. Whats the point. The forums are only posted by a small quantity of pple. Any manufacturers inside? You overhaul engines before? I have a lot of anyhow run in engines in my company. OK, I work in Comfortdelgro SBST as a vehicle workshop Technical Officer. See all types of automotive parts until I blur. And these engines end up with compression problems. I see until scared. Some bike shops who really bothered, all advised their customers to run in according to the manufacturer. At least the 1st stage. Boring of holes is done progressively. Same with engines. The reason is because when they manufacture the engine, the dimensions of the combustion chambers, Piston ring external diameters how tight they are how much compression ratio, how much compression pressure are calculated in it. They expect the engine to last this way. Different manufacturers have different recommended running in methods. Because different manufacturers manufacture the engines differently. What valve seat better with hard run in all these are bullshiit. You haven't seen con rod broke with anyhow run in before? Or scratched combustion chambers? I have these once in a while. Next time come out show you, you want? I dun like to hide behind the monitor and type. Anybody can come find me at the workshop if they dun believe. My HP is 97429240.

 

And by the way, please dun try to act big brother lah... Compared to the real pros you're still lagging far behind. Dun stay in your own circle and be a little tribe leader. Go into the world and see how high the other mountains are. I saw your old bike before... quite jialat. Otherwise you think everyone thinks you're good? Skillful? Only a handful of your fellow tribesmen. Many other people including the top few racers locally call you one of the most handgun riders. And you actually know some of them. Shoot katakiller very shiok? Try and chase him in the track.... after that then decide whether you still want to shoot him. (Or are you still qualified) Sometimes he wanna exaggerate is to disturb pple see who want to act big brother go shoot him.

 

Even if I post here like that pple come and flame me is only a small handful of pple in the whole world. And its an individual opinion. You want to run in the 'WW way', do it yourself. Dun drag other pple in with you. I know I do offend pple with my words, but its the truth in the bottom of my heart.

 

Sorry have to say this in main to show how misleading you have been. I once said the handgun riders take off fairing thinks he's a mechanic, changed coolant regardless he did it right or not thinks he's an engineer. Pull a few wheelies thinks he's an expert, Cruise a few laps in the track thinks he's a racer. And you fit the total bill.

 

Thanks for anybody for reading this long post.

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Originally posted by MS@Jan 13 2006, 09:35 AM

Hey come on lah WW, I find you ah... very Hand gun... Always wanna act big brother. Then act humble but feels so shiok when pple put you high. When someone points out your mistake you cannot stand it and wanna prove him wrong. Unity sure has a way to hold your nose and turn around. C'mon lah... Dun mislead the newbies lah... You go and take 2 brand new bikes run in them one with the manufacturer specs and one in your "WW endorsed way". Both bikes will be powerful within the first 2 or 3 thousand km. And Running in is not the only factor that affects the engine power. There're many other things like choice of Engine oil, maintenance, your gearbox condition, clutch condition etc. If both maintain the same way, You strip both engines after 30000KM and see the difference. Excel cycles took over some famous hard run in engines from famous people. The mechanic down there curse and swear. That engine was a time bomb. There's a hayabusa in a very bad condition there now. Go there take a look. Go and overhaul engines.... Then you will know why the manufacturers have to recommend their way of running in. You dun even know how an engine's fundamentals works and kept spreading wrong info.

 

Enfant said it in a very blunt way. But what he said is what the automotive personnel say it. I know him personally and he works closely with the automotive clients. You keep going into forums after forums all old wives tales but never check with the agents or the manufacturers or real life professionals. Whats the point. The forums are only posted by a small quantity of pple. Any manufacturers inside? You overhaul engines before? I have a lot of anyhow run in engines in my company. OK, I work in Comfortdelgro SBST as a vehicle workshop Technical Officer. See all types of automotive parts until I blur. And these engines end up with compression problems. I see until scared. Some bike shops who really bothered, all advised their customers to run in according to the manufacturer. At least the 1st stage. Boring of holes is done progressively. Same with engines. The reason is because when they manufacture the engine, the dimensions of the combustion chambers, Piston ring external diameters how tight they are how much compression ratio, how much compression pressure are calculated in it. They expect the engine to last this way. Different manufacturers have different recommended running in methods. Because different manufacturers manufacture the engines differently. What valve seat better with hard run in all these are bullshiit. You haven't seen con rod broke with anyhow run in before? Or scratched combustion chambers? I have these once in a while. Next time come out show you, you want? I dun like to hide behind the monitor and type. Anybody can come find me at the workshop if they dun believe. My HP is 97429240.

 

And by the way, please dun try to act big brother lah... Compared to the real pros you're still lagging far behind. Dun stay in your own circle and be a little tribe leader. Go into the world and see how high the other mountains are. I saw your old bike before... quite jialat. Otherwise you think everyone thinks you're good? Skillful? Only a handful of your fellow tribesmen. Many other people including the top few racers locally call you one of the most handgun riders. And you actually know some of them. Shoot katakiller very shiok? Try and chase him in the track.... after that then decide whether you still want to shoot him. (Or are you still qualified) Sometimes he wanna exaggerate is to disturb pple see who want to act big brother go shoot him.

 

Even if I post here like that pple come and flame me is only a small handful of pple in the whole world. And its an individual opinion. You want to run in the 'WW way', do it yourself. Dun drag other pple in with you. I know I do offend pple with my words, but its the truth in the bottom of my heart.

 

Sorry have to say this in main to show how misleading you have been. I once said the handgun riders take off fairing thinks he's a mechanic, changed coolant regardless he did it right or not thinks he's an engineer. Pull a few wheelies thinks he's an expert, Cruise a few laps in the track thinks he's a racer. And you fit the total bill.

 

Thanks for anybody for reading this long post.

Mr. MS, you work as wat , i dun care. I nver act as wat your so call big brother.

And you tell mi to chase kata in the track, why dun you tell him to chase mi in the track. or you chase mi in the track.

 

You say my old bike jialat????? where you saw it?????? maybe my old bike can still can beat you upside up.

 

You say alot of pro racer know mi as a wat you so call hand gun rider??? i think you fit more than mi for this tittle.Than wat you know about bike????

 

And you say i mislead newbies??? uncle how i mislead???? than why dun you go to all other forums and say the hard break in is very misleading. Since you so expert.

 

And i didt say the manufacturer break in of engine was not good. i only say hard break in save time.As for the extra bhp, i already say , it my own point of view and can be prove.

 

And i didt change coolant before, and i dun really cruise in track unlike you. And yes, i pull very good wheelie .

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And yes, anyone also can come and find mi my hp is 96946964 ,to see the dyno graph. i also dun like to hide behind computer and type.

 

I would love MR.MS to come and have a chat with mi , tonight some R1 biker is goign to 2nd link , mr. MS wish to join in the fun???since you also ride a R1.

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Once again, to each his own... Peace bros... :sweat:

First learn stand, then learn fly. Nature's rules biker-sans. Not mine...

http://img15.imageshack.us/img15/1859/11superbikesmackdown11.jpg

The more we get together, the FASTER we'll be..

 

Mar 93 - Oct 94 : TZR125 FF5209R

Oct 94 - May 98 : GSX R400N FK3745K

May 98 - Oct 05 : GSX R400R FN3306D

Oct 05 - June 11 : '02 YZF R1 FBF3637M

June 11 - Feb 19 : '11 ZX10R

Feb 19 - ??????? : '14 S1000RR

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Originally posted by MS@Jan 13 2006, 09:35 AM

Hey come on lah WW, I find you ah... very Hand gun... Always wanna act big brother. Then act humble but feels so shiok when pple put you high. When someone points out your mistake you cannot stand it and wanna prove him wrong. Unity sure has a way to hold your nose and turn around. C'mon lah... Dun mislead the newbies lah... You go and take 2 brand new bikes run in them one with the manufacturer specs and one in your "WW endorsed way". Both bikes will be powerful within the first 2 or 3 thousand km. And Running in is not the only factor that affects the engine power. There're many other things like choice of Engine oil, maintenance, your gearbox condition, clutch condition etc. If both maintain the same way, You strip both engines after 30000KM and see the difference. Excel cycles took over some famous hard run in engines from famous people. The mechanic down there curse and swear. That engine was a time bomb. There's a hayabusa in a very bad condition there now. Go there take a look. Go and overhaul engines.... Then you will know why the manufacturers have to recommend their way of running in. You dun even know how an engine's fundamentals works and kept spreading wrong info.

 

Enfant said it in a very blunt way. But what he said is what the automotive personnel say it. I know him personally and he works closely with the automotive clients. You keep going into forums after forums all old wives tales but never check with the agents or the manufacturers or real life professionals. Whats the point. The forums are only posted by a small quantity of pple. Any manufacturers inside? You overhaul engines before? I have a lot of anyhow run in engines in my company. OK, I work in Comfortdelgro SBST as a vehicle workshop Technical Officer. See all types of automotive parts until I blur. And these engines end up with compression problems. I see until scared. Some bike shops who really bothered, all advised their customers to run in according to the manufacturer. At least the 1st stage. Boring of holes is done progressively. Same with engines. The reason is because when they manufacture the engine, the dimensions of the combustion chambers, Piston ring external diameters how tight they are how much compression ratio, how much compression pressure are calculated in it. They expect the engine to last this way. Different manufacturers have different recommended running in methods. Because different manufacturers manufacture the engines differently. What valve seat better with hard run in all these are bullshiit. You haven't seen con rod broke with anyhow run in before? Or scratched combustion chambers? I have these once in a while. Next time come out show you, you want? I dun like to hide behind the monitor and type. Anybody can come find me at the workshop if they dun believe. My HP is 97429240.

 

And by the way, please dun try to act big brother lah... Compared to the real pros you're still lagging far behind. Dun stay in your own circle and be a little tribe leader. Go into the world and see how high the other mountains are. I saw your old bike before... quite jialat. Otherwise you think everyone thinks you're good? Skillful? Only a handful of your fellow tribesmen. Many other people including the top few racers locally call you one of the most handgun riders. And you actually know some of them. Shoot katakiller very shiok? Try and chase him in the track.... after that then decide whether you still want to shoot him. (Or are you still qualified) Sometimes he wanna exaggerate is to disturb pple see who want to act big brother go shoot him.

 

Even if I post here like that pple come and flame me is only a small handful of pple in the whole world. And its an individual opinion. You want to run in the 'WW way', do it yourself. Dun drag other pple in with you. I know I do offend pple with my words, but its the truth in the bottom of my heart.

 

Sorry have to say this in main to show how misleading you have been. I once said the handgun riders take off fairing thinks he's a mechanic, changed coolant regardless he did it right or not thinks he's an engineer. Pull a few wheelies thinks he's an expert, Cruise a few laps in the track thinks he's a racer. And you fit the total bill.

 

Thanks for anybody for reading this long post.

MS well done, technical discussion, your 2nd posting in the thread and you turned it into a personal attack. Last discussion we had, you were advising people to top up their lead acid batteries with acid, claiming simi real world versus in theory. Pls explain to me why my bike which is high revved much more frequently than the average sportbike, at 40000km and by right shld be consuming copious amount of oil and losing compression with scored bores, still runs smooth and strong? Yet so many sportbike owners, especially those that baby their bikes and ride around gently, have bikes that consume oil and loose compression? You talk so much about scuff bores and broken con rods, and you attribute them ALL to run in? Plenty of reasons for those other than run in issue. Let's see some concrete proof, not just some pics of damage or cases you saw. There could be ton of contributing factors that you will not know. Don't link A and B just because you want it to in order to win an internet ego trip.

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Originally posted by alj@Jan 13 2006, 11:55 AM

Er ... cool it bro .... we are here to share information, not so much into flaming and unnecessary conflicts right :smile:

Ya lor... :sweat: Suddenly I feel like I'm in the company of human torches like Johnny Storm in 'The Fantastic Four'. "FLAME ON!" :angry:

First learn stand, then learn fly. Nature's rules biker-sans. Not mine...

http://img15.imageshack.us/img15/1859/11superbikesmackdown11.jpg

The more we get together, the FASTER we'll be..

 

Mar 93 - Oct 94 : TZR125 FF5209R

Oct 94 - May 98 : GSX R400N FK3745K

May 98 - Oct 05 : GSX R400R FN3306D

Oct 05 - June 11 : '02 YZF R1 FBF3637M

June 11 - Feb 19 : '11 ZX10R

Feb 19 - ??????? : '14 S1000RR

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Originally posted by GerardSantaCruz@Jan 13 2006, 11:48 AM

hey easy man....

MS is my friend and WW is my fellow magician.

i feel like the beef between 2 bread.

:lol:

if you guys are coming out and talk. pls talk "gentlemenly"...

:thumb:

I am ok , it just a sharing info place. Maybe MS like mi too much ,and start a personal attack.

 

One thing i like to high light, maybe i Sometimes i also wanna exaggerate is to disturb pple see who want to act big brother go shoot mi.And look it our big brother MS come shooting mi. So you say i shoot kata, i big brother, than now you shoot mi, you also one very big brother.

 

And those top few racers locally call mi one of the most handgun riders. And i actually know some of them. So which is some of them? and i got so famous till TOP LOCAL RACER know mi, and i dun know them. Maybe can name a few?

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Originally posted by Aie@Jan 13 2006, 12:08 PM

Ya lor... :sweat: Suddenly I feel like I'm in the company of human torches like Johnny Storm in 'The Fantastic Four'. "FLAME ON!" :angry:

Gerard, WW

While reading back, I feel that I really took it personal by relieveing my bottled up feelings about WW. I apologise for that. I dun wan you to feel like you're in the middle meat in sandwich. The last thing i want is a flame thread.

 

However the claims that I said on the technical parts will still stand no matter what. I have been in this industry for quite some time. I used to believe in the hard run in years ago before I started to learn about automotives.

 

Engines itself are tonnes easier to do than gearboxes. But engines are also fragile. Previously I have said that manufacturers have calculated everything before deciding on the running in recommendations is also true. I have engines re-conditioning by my HQ and do some engines re-conditioning and have to recommend a form of running in according to the directives I receive. I have been stressed by higher management to allow engines to run in to preserve engines lifespan. I am in this industry and so it is up to the individual reader to choose who he wants to believe.

 

High bhp is achievable is becos the engine is new or well maintained. Many factors contribute to engine breakdown. Anyhow run in is one of them. And suzuki 1000 K5 is itself an extremely powerful bike by nature as feedbacked by some local racers. But as the running in is not done progressively, the parts do not seat properly. And thus end up in premature wear as mileague builds. How premature wear have to see the engine make, quality, how bad was the maintenance and running in. There're also many other facts that contribute. Don't talk about my workshop. Other workshops like Excel cycles had to spend a lot of money doing back some of the famous pple's bikes who propaganded their way of running in.

 

If anyone is interested in knowing more, can contact the manufacturers themselves and how they reply. Their replies are the most recommended. Do not believe in old wives tales. Rather go and seek back the one who manufacture the equipment. Becos they know best and they have to give you the best advise to uphold their quality.

 

Some of the forummers claimed about how good they are in their technical expertise. And offers to help do other pple bike. Beware when they cannot offer warranty. I have already seen cases where they were steps away from causing damages to other pple's bikes. Even when I reply to this, I'd always advise pple to refer back to manufacturers or a reliable bike shop to verify.

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Originally posted by MS@Jan 13 2006, 12:39 PM

Gerard, WW

While reading back, I feel that I really took it personal by relieveing my bottled up feelings about WW. I apologise for that. I dun wan you to feel like you're in the middle meat in sandwich. The last thing i want is a flame thread.

 

However the claims that I said on the technical parts will still stand no matter what. I have been in this industry for quite some time. I used to believe in the hard run in years ago before I started to learn about automotives.

 

Engines itself are tonnes easier to do than gearboxes. But engines are also fragile. Previously I have said that manufacturers have calculated everything before deciding on the running in recommendations is also true. I have engines re-conditioning by my HQ and do some engines re-conditioning and have to recommend a form of running in according to the directives I receive. I have been stressed by higher management to allow engines to run in to preserve engines lifespan. I am in this industry and so it is up to the individual reader to choose who he wants to believe.

 

High bhp is achievable is becos the engine is new or well maintained. Many factors contribute to engine breakdown. Anyhow run in is one of them. And suzuki 1000 K5 is itself an extremely powerful bike by nature as feedbacked by some local racers. But as the running in is not done progressively, the parts do not seat properly. And thus end up in premature wear as mileague builds. How premature wear have to see the engine make, quality, how bad was the maintenance and running in. There're also many other facts that contribute. Don't talk about my workshop. Other workshops like Excel cycles had to spend a lot of money doing back some of the famous pple's bikes who propaganded their way of running in.

 

If anyone is interested in knowing more, can contact the manufacturers themselves and how they reply. Their replies are the most recommended. Do not believe in old wives tales. Rather go and seek back the one who manufacture the equipment. Becos they know best and they have to give you the best advise to uphold their quality.

 

Some of the forummers claimed about how good they are in their technical expertise. And offers to help do other pple bike. Beware when they cannot offer warranty. I have already seen cases where they were steps away from causing damages to other pple's bikes. Even when I reply to this, I'd always advise pple to refer back to manufacturers or a reliable bike shop to verify.

Now that's the way to explain matters, my hat's off to you MS. :clapping: Rational, concise and straight to the heart of the matter with no sarcastic remarks. If his post is an essay, I would have given MS an A+. :thumb:

First learn stand, then learn fly. Nature's rules biker-sans. Not mine...

http://img15.imageshack.us/img15/1859/11superbikesmackdown11.jpg

The more we get together, the FASTER we'll be..

 

Mar 93 - Oct 94 : TZR125 FF5209R

Oct 94 - May 98 : GSX R400N FK3745K

May 98 - Oct 05 : GSX R400R FN3306D

Oct 05 - June 11 : '02 YZF R1 FBF3637M

June 11 - Feb 19 : '11 ZX10R

Feb 19 - ??????? : '14 S1000RR

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Originally posted by MS@Jan 13 2006, 12:39 PM

Gerard, WW

While reading back, I feel that I really took it personal by relieveing my bottled up feelings about WW. I apologise for that. I dun wan you to feel like you're in the middle meat in sandwich. The last thing i want is a flame thread.

 

However the claims that I said on the technical parts will still stand no matter what. I have been in this industry for quite some time. I used to believe in the hard run in years ago before I started to learn about automotives.

 

Engines itself are tonnes easier to do than gearboxes. But engines are also fragile. Previously I have said that manufacturers have calculated everything before deciding on the running in recommendations is also true. I have engines re-conditioning by my HQ and do some engines re-conditioning and have to recommend a form of running in according to the directives I receive. I have been stressed by higher management to allow engines to run in to preserve engines lifespan. I am in this industry and so it is up to the individual reader to choose who he wants to believe.

 

High bhp is achievable is becos the engine is new or well maintained. Many factors contribute to engine breakdown. Anyhow run in is one of them. And suzuki 1000 K5 is itself an extremely powerful bike by nature as feedbacked by some local racers. But as the running in is not done progressively, the parts do not seat properly. And thus end up in premature wear as mileague builds. How premature wear have to see the engine make, quality, how bad was the maintenance and running in. There're also many other facts that contribute. Don't talk about my workshop. Other workshops like Excel cycles had to spend a lot of money doing back some of the famous pple's bikes who propaganded their way of running in.

 

If anyone is interested in knowing more, can contact the manufacturers themselves and how they reply. Their replies are the most recommended. Do not believe in old wives tales. Rather go and seek back the one who manufacture the equipment. Becos they know best and they have to give you the best advise to uphold their quality.

 

Some of the forummers claimed about how good they are in their technical expertise. And offers to help do other pple bike. Beware when they cannot offer warranty. I have already seen cases where they were steps away from causing damages to other pple's bikes. Even when I reply to this, I'd always advise pple to refer back to manufacturers or a reliable bike shop to verify.

Mr. MS, it really ok de. You share your knowleage with other, and till now , those that had ask mi for the hard run in method, had no complain about that. And i dun come up with the hard run in method. it someone in the US ,or so call motortune.If really the hard run in will make your bike have problem in futre. Than i think he already been kill by many other biker in the world.

As wat teebeephobe had say, a engine break down could be some other problem.

And you say alot of famous ppl bike, been done by excel. And spend a lot of money on it. but who pay for the repair? excel or the biker itself???

And you also did say a lot of local racer bike is like a time bomb, and since your say that, i think their bike usually max out on track, so wear and tear is more than those that ride normaly. And how can the mech tell the different ,it cause by the run in time and not by the racer,when it max out the bike on track.

And dont tell mi,if i run in the bike recommend by the manfacturer,and later a racer use it on track ,it wont break down???

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WW, motoman did not invent the 'hard break in'. Engines have been initial or fully run in hard at most if not all factories. It part of assembly and QC. MS quoted a lot of cases which seem like smoke bombs. Examples such as conrod breaking is not even closely related to 'run in'. There is nothing to 'break in' on the conrod bearings or wrist pins. Oil starvation or poor warmup before loading the engine is the main contributing factors to such issue on top of metallurgical defects. I'm still waiting for MS to educate me why my bike isn't emitting bluish smoke by now, it should according to him. In fact, my exhaust is so clean, I can stick my finger in it and eat a burger without washing my hands, no duakang see to believe. Welcome bets too.

http://picturesky.com/albums/userpics/11161/yamaha.jpg<span style=\'font-family:impact\'>I go 60 nia

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Originally posted by TeePeePhobe@Jan 13 2006, 04:35 PM

WW, motoman did not invent the 'hard break in'. Engines have been initial or fully run in hard at most if not all factories. It part of assembly and QC. MS quoted a lot of cases which seem like smoke bombs. Examples such as conrod breaking is not even closely related to 'run in'. There is nothing to 'break in' on the conrod bearings or wrist pins. Oil starvation or poor warmup before loading the engine is the main contributing factors to such issue on top of metallurgical defects. I'm still waiting for MS to educate me why my bike isn't emitting bluish smoke by now, it should according to him. In fact, my exhaust is so clean, I can stick my finger in it and eat a burger without washing my hands, no duakang see to believe. Welcome bets too.

ok ok, cos i come across when i read the motortune method of running in a new engine.

i wnat the burger with out the bet. ok?

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Originally posted by TeePeePhobe@Jan 13 2006, 04:35 PM

In fact, my exhaust is so clean, I can stick my finger in it and eat a burger without washing my hands, no duakang see to believe. Welcome bets too.

Two all beef patties, special sauce, lettuce, cheese, pickles, onions on a sesame seed bun? :slurp:

First learn stand, then learn fly. Nature's rules biker-sans. Not mine...

http://img15.imageshack.us/img15/1859/11superbikesmackdown11.jpg

The more we get together, the FASTER we'll be..

 

Mar 93 - Oct 94 : TZR125 FF5209R

Oct 94 - May 98 : GSX R400N FK3745K

May 98 - Oct 05 : GSX R400R FN3306D

Oct 05 - June 11 : '02 YZF R1 FBF3637M

June 11 - Feb 19 : '11 ZX10R

Feb 19 - ??????? : '14 S1000RR

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Originally posted by TeePeePhobe@Jan 13 2006, 04:35 PM

WW, motoman did not invent the 'hard break in'. Engines have been initial or fully run in hard at most if not all factories. It part of assembly and QC. MS quoted a lot of cases which seem like smoke bombs. Examples such as conrod breaking is not even closely related to 'run in'. There is nothing to 'break in' on the conrod bearings or wrist pins. Oil starvation or poor warmup before loading the engine is the main contributing factors to such issue on top of metallurgical defects. I'm still waiting for MS to educate me why my bike isn't emitting bluish smoke by now, it should according to him. In fact, my exhaust is so clean, I can stick my finger in it and eat a burger without washing my hands, no duakang see to believe. Welcome bets too.

how long have u ridden your r6? 5 years? 6 years? compression loss and piston leakage usually present itself a few years after hard run in methods are practiced. you don't take a teaspoon of arsenic and ask someone why you do not die immediately. try daily doses everyday and we'll see who's lying 6 feet under when chinese new year comes.

another similar example would be the class 2a sport bikes. some 400s consume thin engine oil at alarming rates compared to rare older models which have hardly any problems at all. all these nonsense present themselves after 10 over years of usage. why is it that some do not face this problem? i do not think that any singaporean would be rich or stupid enough to opt for an engine overhaul. nobody does that for their 400, it's simply not worth the money. then again, your arguement of bikes being worned hard in the track is true, but how many of these bikes were owned by track junkies? all that ms was trying to get across was the fact that hard run in might and CAN cause serious engine deterioration in the long run and since most riders do not ride their wheels for more than a few years before upgrading, the 2nd hand owners who take over will bear the brunt of their hard run in damages.

if someone doesn't take this into consideration, one is being selfish. if there is a chance of preventing compression loss, one should take the necessary steps to do so and not practice unorthodox methods just to benefit from saving some time. this is exactly why many people are afraid of 2nd hand class 2 bikes. hard run in? i rather get a new bike and run it in the way that manufacturers recommend.

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Originally posted by TeePeePhobe@Jan 13 2006, 04:35 PM

I'm still waiting for MS to educate me why my bike isn't emitting bluish smoke by now, it should according to him. In fact, my exhaust is so clean, I can stick my finger in it and eat a burger without washing my hands, no duakang see to believe.

Er not trying to argue with u bro .... just sharing with u that exhaust without carbon is not just based on engine oil leaking into piston chamber or not ...

 

Some factors also contribute to it ... Well tuned engines and EFI or carb, constant clearing of carbon built ups are the 2 basic thing that prevent carbon built ups.

 

But of course, if there is engine oil leaking into your piston chamber which u are talking about as in hard run ins which will spoil or shorten your engine or not is still abit early to tell if your bike is not more than 3 years old ....

 

Cause that's the reason why LTA set the rules that brand new vehicles do not need to go through the yearly inspection is cause no matter what u did to your vehicle, bike or car, the first 3 years is very safe .... Its only after the 3 years then problems will start to surface.

 

In Japan, their COE last for 3 years only and that's the reason that the Japanese manufacturers manufacture vehicles that will last for the first 3 years only and the rest of their competitors follow suit ....

 

So no offence bro :cheeky:

What say u :angel:

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Originally posted by enfant@Jan 13 2006, 08:14 PM

how long have u ridden your r6? 5 years? 6 years? compression loss and piston leakage usually present itself a few years after hard run in methods are practiced. you don't take a teaspoon of arsenic and ask someone why you do not die immediately. try daily doses everyday and we'll see who's lying 6 feet under when chinese new year comes.

another similar example would be the class 2a sport bikes. some 400s consume thin engine oil at alarming rates compared to rare older models which have hardly any problems at all. all these nonsense present themselves after 10 over years of usage. why is it that some do not face this problem? i do not think that any singaporean would be rich or stupid enough to opt for an engine overhaul. nobody does that for their 400, it's simply not worth the money. then again, your arguement of bikes being worned hard in the track is true, but how many of these bikes were owned by track junkies? all that ms was trying to get across was the fact that hard run in might and CAN cause serious engine deterioration in the long run and since most riders do not ride their wheels for more than a few years before upgrading, the 2nd hand owners who take over will bear the brunt of their hard run in damages.

if someone doesn't take this into consideration, one is being selfish. if there is a chance of preventing compression loss, one should take the necessary steps to do so and not practice unorthodox methods just to benefit from saving some time. this is exactly why many people are afraid of 2nd hand class 2 bikes. hard run in? i rather get a new bike and run it in the way that manufacturers recommend.

i really wonder if you got a very problem 2nd hand bike??? If you are scare of the bike you going to buy got problem, cos it 2nd hand ,and many biker that bought it first hand didt run in properly ,than as you suject , go get a new bike.

And you keep blaming it on the hard run in that casue the damage. So you mean after i get the bike , i run in as wat the manfauctur recommend, my bike can last forever??

 

Even if you run in the bike properly, when you buy second hand , it will defintely got some problem that why is call 2nd hand.

Wat bike are you riding now, i wish to take over from you , when you decided to upgrade or sell it. must be a very well kept bike.

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Originally posted by alj@Jan 13 2006, 08:28 PM

Cause that's the reason why LTA set the rules that brand new vehicles do not need to go through the yearly inspection is cause no matter what u did to your vehicle, bike or car, the first 3 years is very safe .... Its only after the 3 years then problems will start to surface.

 

 

 

So no offence bro :cheeky:

I think you better go check with LTA ,why they set 3rd yr inspection on new vehicles. Before you say these.

:smile:

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So you mean after i get the bike , i run in as wat the manfauctur recommend, my bike can last forever??

no but it will definitely last much longer.

 

Even if you run in the bike properly, when you buy second hand , it will defintely got some problem that why is call 2nd hand.

that is an extremely stupid way of looking at things. 2nd hand bikes does not mean that it MUST have problems. there are 2nd hand bikes that are well maintained that do not cause sleepless nights for their new owners.

 

Wat bike are you riding now, i wish to take over from you , when you decided to upgrade or sell it. must be a very well kept bike.

i have no bike, i have no license, i come in here to entertain. i am still in primary 5.

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Originally posted by enfant@Jan 13 2006, 09:20 PM

So you mean after i get the bike , i run in as wat the manfauctur recommend, my bike can last forever??

no but it will definitely last much longer.

 

Even if you run in the bike properly, when you buy second hand , it will defintely got some problem that why is call 2nd hand.

that is an extremely stupid way of looking at things. 2nd hand bikes does not mean that it MUST have problems. there are 2nd hand bikes that are well maintained that do not cause sleepless nights for their new owners.

 

Wat bike are you riding now, i wish to take over from you , when you decided to upgrade or sell it. must be a very well kept bike.

i have no bike, i have no license, i come in here to entertain. i am still in primary 5.

Wow, pri 5 only , know so much thing laio. LIHI :clap:

 

Next time when selling your bike call mi, i buy from you.

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So you mean after i get the bike , i run in as wat the manfauctur recommend, my bike can last forever??

no but it will definitely last much longer.

 

Even if you run in the bike properly, when you buy second hand , it will defintely got some problem that why is call 2nd hand.

that is an extremely stupid way of looking at things. 2nd hand bikes does not mean that it MUST have problems. there are 2nd hand bikes that are well maintained that do not cause sleepless nights for their new owners.

 

Wat bike are you riding now, i wish to take over from you , when you decided to upgrade or sell it. must be a very well kept bike.

i have no bike, i have no license, i come in here to entertain. i am still in primary 5.

relax bro.. i dun mean to join in ...:sorry: (I Netural)

 

In forum we juz wan to share our knowledge and experience.. No 'cannon or 'Big hole' here.. i dun mean u both..

 

Keep it cool

ee

both are experience rider here, think there muzt be some misunderstanding in between.

 

:smile: No offence guys

 

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