Caution buying used bikes

[blackness]

Going by your logic, every bike that renews COE is all worth the same value ie the prevailing COE PQP, since the machine value is zero upon expiry

 

hwah!!! 10 yr old Ducati classic also same value as Phantom if renew COE....I also want....lol

 

hahahaha! but too bad, want cheap bikes must go toy r us. Maybe they have hayabusa there.

[kzone]

guys, why pick on teambhp's flawed logic when he also got a valid point which is that many 2nd hand bike sellers are asking for ridiculous amount espescially those nearing end of COE expiry. Let's ignore his unique "philisophy" of zero value after coe expiry which we all know is nonsense. He spending time to highlight overpriced bikes in this sales thread is commendable as it will help to give the newbies another perspective to a bike's value other than the seller's own.

 

maybe the rest of us can balance this thread by providing real current examples of attractively priced bikes posted in the sales section here.

[mechwira]

guys, why pick on teambhp's flawed logic when he also got a valid point which is that many 2nd hand bike sellers are asking for ridiculous amount espescially those nearing end of COE expiry. Let's ignore his unique "philisophy" of zero value after coe expiry which we all know is nonsense. He spending time to highlight overpriced bikes in this sales thread is commendable as it will help to give the newbies another perspective to a bike's value other than the seller's own.

 

maybe the rest of us can balance this thread by providing real current examples of attractively priced bikes posted in the sales section here.

 

i have never argued against the idea that a)one must be sure of the bike's condition before buying, and b)some sellers are asking for unrealistically high prices, and don't buy at such ridiculous prices.

 

i would think the above is common sense, but maybe common sense is not common and its good advice nonetheless. i said so before that indeed some of the examples given are too high prices.

 

i think at the end of the day, people started by politely pointing out that the concepts of depreciation and secondhand are completely wrong, which come on, this is a forum thats what its for isn it? but if it degenerates because the person insists he is correct, does not answer clear counterpoints and instead dismisses the valid counterpoints as immature, well.....

 

i just think it is good that people correct wrong concepts, because if not others might take wrong concepts to be true.

[Jehuty]

Dear Readers

 

There are many bikes on sales in this forum. Some are from direct owners and some are from bikeshops.

 

I would like to caution about buying from direct owners. Some of the questions you should think about are

 

1) Owner has changed a lot of parts on the bike, added accesssories etc. Some even overhauled the engine and claim that bike is in good condtion. Think about it! Why would anyone in the world spend money to repair the bike, then sell it off to you?

 

2) All bikes have wear and tear items. The older the bike, the more problematic it is. Yet there are sellers claiming that the bike is in prefect condtion. How is that possible? Even new bikes are not prefect.

 

3) Assuming you find a really good offer. Seller dilligently maintain bike. Outlook is good. Wear and tear parts replaced and there are receipts to prove. You want to buy from him/her. Please think again. Outlook can be done nicely. Parts can be replaced by a good seller. One word of caution though....Internal leaks within the engine that cannot be seen by the naked eye.

 

For example, if the bike has excessive oil consumption problem, you will not know it till you have clocked up some mileage. By the time you know, it is too late. How about coolant seeping into the combustion chamber slowly? It will be months later before the bike will give out smoke. Do you have recourse? Anwer is NO.

 

Therefore, please buy with care and ride safe.

 

1)He could be desperate, he could have alot of money or he could simply not care, not everyone is the same. You can't just lump everyone to have the same mindset as you do

 

2)Perfect condition means its is problem free and runs without a hitch, I have had 10 year old bikes that needed nothing much, didnt break down. It could also be low mileage and never revved to the moon, kept in a corrosion free environment therefore very little wear and tear to speak of.

 

3)Internal leaks you as the first owner of the bike also won't know until it rears its ugly head. Anyway define internal leaks.

 

By your cautionary, don't buy bikes. Anyway if its cheap because it might have problems then gamble ah

[teambhp]

Ok guys... How about pointing out attractively priced bikes in the sales section? Are there really any?

[kzone]

i have never argued against the idea that a)one must be sure of the bike's condition before buying, and b)some sellers are asking for unrealistically high prices, and don't buy at such ridiculous prices.

 

i would think the above is common sense, but maybe common sense is not common and its good advice nonetheless. i said so before that indeed some of the examples given are too high prices.

 

i think at the end of the day, people started by politely pointing out that the concepts of depreciation and secondhand are completely wrong, which come on, this is a forum thats what its for isn it? but if it degenerates because the person insists he is correct, does not answer clear counterpoints and instead dismisses the valid counterpoints as immature, well.....

 

i just think it is good that people correct wrong concepts, because if not others might take wrong concepts to be true.

 

agree with your last sentence... hope we have done enough so others can rightly identify what's right and what's flawed.

 

now time to identify good buys!

[teambhp]

Now awaiting people here to point out the value for money bikes

[teambhp]

COE till April 2008 (slightly less than 3 yrs to expiry)

Selling 11k

Dep per year=$3666

 

 

http://www.singaporebikes.com/forums/showthread.php/427114-WTS-08-Honda-CB400-Revo-w-ABS

[teambhp]

COE till April 2008 (slightly less than 3 yrs to expiry)

Selling 9.8k

Dep per year=$3266

 

 

http://www.singaporebikes.com/forums/showthread.php/427614-WTS-Excellent-condition-CB400-Revo-Power-Cup-Edition-for-sale

[kzone]

teambhp, this one only $500 per year. lol

 

http://www.singaporebikes.com/forums/showthread.php/427727-Super-RARE!-Honda-SPACY-CH125-Scooter-(1984)-COE-2024

 

 

this one also $500ish

 

http://www.singaporebikes.com/forums/showthread.php/427725-WTS-Yamaha-Spark-135cc

[teambhp]

teambhp, this one only $500plus per year. lol

 

http://www.singaporebikes.com/forums/showthread.php/427727-Super-RARE!-Honda-SPACY-CH125-Scooter-(1984)-COE-2024

Yep. We are providing info only.the buyers decide

[mechwira]

teambhp, this one only $500 per year. lol

 

http://www.singaporebikes.com/forums/showthread.php/427727-Super-RARE!-Honda-SPACY-CH125-Scooter-(1984)-COE-2024

 

 

this one also $500ish

 

http://www.singaporebikes.com/forums/showthread.php/427725-WTS-Yamaha-Spark-135cc

 

wha...... you're kidding right....?

 

 

 

oh wait.... you are!

:lol:

[battle]

Sharing my personal experience as a 1st timer 2B just passed rider hunting for bike.

 

As usual, sourcing for a bike of my choice within my budget. Arrange to go viewing. At CP, test ride short distance (50m), have a bit of feel of the bike, look c look c......

- Bike looks ok. just a bit of crack at the rear, looks ok to me.

- Ride feel, a bit off balance, can't tell if it's the rider or the bike, also its on those tiled type carpark... so I blame on me (the rider)

 

Then come my uncle, experienced biker, brought along a mechanics to help access the bike ..... OMG.....

When I test ride, can't feel much (the only experience I have is Driving centre bike which is pretty crap, during expressway familiarisation ride at 80+ km/h the bike vibrate till like going to fall apart......

Feedback.....

- Fork not balanced (seems like the bike experience some frontal accident, but can be fix, not $XXX, commented hopefully the rider who goot the accident is ok.... !!! @_@)

- Engine area (to me seems like simply dirty, but mech advice, engine gasket somewhere no good liao, got sign of slow leakage !!!)

- sprocket ware off liao. time to replace

- Chain might need replacement as well

- tyre harden liao, better to replace for safety

- brake working good... (heng)....

 

OMG.... Bike over priced as well as advice by both Mech and my uncle.... okie.....

 

End up I didn't buy the bike.

 

 

Lesson... if you have uncle/auntie or relatives or friends have been riding for a long time, experienced, know people who can advice or help, seriously seek their help or advice in getting your first 2nd hand bike.

Really more for safety and piece of mind riding.

SG road already not safe for biker with tonnes of car simply change lane without signal, squeeze or push us bikers from behind staying so bloody close for comfort........

 

So the last thing we want is a not reliable bike....

 

Just sharing my personal experience... ; )

[kzone]

wha...... you're kidding right....?

 

 

 

oh wait.... you are!

:lol:

 

errr.. I'm just stating facts

[kzone]

Sharing my personal experience as a 1st timer 2B just passed rider hunting for bike.

 

As usual, sourcing for a bike of my choice within my budget. Arrange to go viewing. At CP, test ride short distance (50m), have a bit of feel of the bike, look c look c......

- Bike looks ok. just a bit of crack at the rear, looks ok to me.

- Ride feel, a bit off balance, can't tell if it's the rider or the bike, also its on those tiled type carpark... so I blame on me (the rider)

 

Then come my uncle, experienced biker, brought along a mechanics to help access the bike ..... OMG.....

When I test ride, can't feel much (the only experience I have is Driving centre bike which is pretty crap, during expressway familiarisation ride at 80+ km/h the bike vibrate till like going to fall apart......

Feedback.....

- Fork not balanced (seems like the bike experience some frontal accident, but can be fix, not $XXX, commented hopefully the rider who goot the accident is ok.... !!! @_@)

- Engine area (to me seems like simply dirty, but mech advice, engine gasket somewhere no good liao, got sign of slow leakage !!!)

- sprocket ware off liao. time to replace

- Chain might need replacement as well

- tyre harden liao, better to replace for safety

- brake working good... (heng)....

 

OMG.... Bike over priced as well as advice by both Mech and my uncle.... okie.....

 

End up I didn't buy the bike.

 

 

Lesson... if you have uncle/auntie or relatives or friends have been riding for a long time, experienced, know people who can advice or help, seriously seek their help or advice in getting your first 2nd hand bike.

Really more for safety and piece of mind riding.

SG road already not safe for biker with tonnes of car simply change lane without signal, squeeze or push us bikers from behind staying so bloody close for comfort........

 

So the last thing we want is a not reliable bike....

 

Just sharing my personal experience... ; )

 

for most bikes, I would factor in the cost of replacing those stuffs you mentioned even without testing. Exception is if i'm certain the owner treat the bikes with lust n is literally n hopelessly in love with his bikes. This type very easy to identify...

[teambhp]

Sharing my personal experience as a 1st timer 2B just passed rider hunting for bike.

 

As usual, sourcing for a bike of my choice within my budget. Arrange to go viewing. At CP, test ride short distance (50m), have a bit of feel of the bike, look c look c......

- Bike looks ok. just a bit of crack at the rear, looks ok to me.

- Ride feel, a bit off balance, can't tell if it's the rider or the bike, also its on those tiled type carpark... so I blame on me (the rider)

 

Then come my uncle, experienced biker, brought along a mechanics to help access the bike ..... OMG.....

When I test ride, can't feel much (the only experience I have is Driving centre bike which is pretty crap, during expressway familiarisation ride at 80+ km/h the bike vibrate till like going to fall apart......

Feedback.....

- Fork not balanced (seems like the bike experience some frontal accident, but can be fix, not $XXX, commented hopefully the rider who goot the accident is ok.... !!! @_@)

- Engine area (to me seems like simply dirty, but mech advice, engine gasket somewhere no good liao, got sign of slow leakage !!!)

- sprocket ware off liao. time to replace

- Chain might need replacement as well

- tyre harden liao, better to replace for safety

- brake working good... (heng)....

 

OMG.... Bike over priced as well as advice by both Mech and my uncle.... okie.....

 

End up I didn't buy the bike.

 

 

Lesson... if you have uncle/auntie or relatives or friends have been riding for a long time, experienced, know people who can advice or help, seriously seek their help or advice in getting your first 2nd hand bike.

Really more for safety and piece of mind riding.

SG road already not safe for biker with tonnes of car simply change lane without signal, squeeze or push us bikers from behind staying so bloody close for comfort........

 

So the last thing we want is a not reliable bike....

 

Just sharing my personal experience... ; )

Thanks for sharing

[guangwei]

Dear Readers

 

There are many bikes on sales in this forum. Some are from direct owners and some are from bikeshops.

Exactly, avoid bikeshops because they are profit driven and they would not know the definition of 'paiseh' and 'feeling of guilt' after working in one of the darkest industry in SG for so many years(according to CASE, motorcycle dealer industry receive one of the highest complaints, just below the likes of mobile phone industry and cars industry)

I would like to caution about buying from direct owners. Some of the questions you should think about are

 

1) Owner has changed a lot of parts on the bike, added accesssories etc. Some even overhauled the engine and claim that bike is in good condtion. Think about it! Why would anyone in the world spend money to repair the bike, then sell it off to you?

Can be many reasons why they wanna sell, could be because they are sick of a persistence prob, but trust me, SG people are generally too thin skinned to do this unless they are profit driven to do something like bikeshop, direct owners may makes plenty of effort to hide the prob, or they would rather just reveal it to you in fear of being expose by you. Because it would be massively paiseh and I can vouch for you SGrean are extremely afraid of paiseh. In addition, because most SG non mechanic industry people are dumb nuts in manual labour, mechanics works, even qualified engineer knows nuts, as most of us dont even have a own garages to experiment even the most basic step of changing engine oil, so its near mission impossible if they want to DIY to hide a very complex problem. This is not the case for bikeshop. I can tell you the most common reason people like to use for performance bike, is that they want to tone down and downgrade as performance litre bikes are not feasible in SG. They wanna quit the games bike.

 

2) All bikes have wear and tear items. The older the bike, the more problematic it is. Yet there are sellers claiming that the bike is in prefect condtion. How is that possible? Even new bikes are not prefect.

Some owner claims that, but if I sell the bike I wont say that, i'd reveal my bike flaws on the spot to the best of my knowledge. Your quite stupid if u believe an old bike is perfect flawless conditions. Its still better some of my bikeshop experience, they dont even rode the bike, yet they just claim their 10 years old SP are in perfect condition because it is the standard procedure and part of the scripts to sell any bikes. They literally read a model script as they can't possibly think and write a new script for every bikes they sell, not trying to be offensive, but bikeshop dealers are usually managed by mechanics with low education. They cant prepare a detailed report of the current health status/history of the bike for hundreds of bikes they are selling, unlike individual direct owners who tends to have a better track of their bike history and some are even to write a full detailed report, more transparent than the government's financial statement.

 

3) Assuming you find a really good offer. Seller dilligently maintain bike. Outlook is good. Wear and tear parts replaced and there are receipts to prove. You want to buy from him/her. Please think again. Outlook can be done nicely. Parts can be replaced by a good seller. One word of caution though....Internal leaks within the engine that cannot be seen by the naked eye.

Bikeshop dont bother about this as well, saw a poor dude who just passed 2B bought a TZM150, bike comes with 1 week warranty. For the first 1 week, the bike was perfect, but exactly 7 days later, once the warranty ended, the whole clutch system broke down. He thought it was a nice deal until the 8th day. Amateur owners in SG usually donno how to do advanced work to hide your mentioned 'internal leaks within the engine that cannot be seen by the naked eye', while the risk of such incident is not 100% foolproof with direct owners purchase, the likelihood with shops is even higher because the shop dealers have mechanics to do the advanced/dark work to hide the prob. I have witnessed it, experienced it.

 

For example, if the bike has excessive oil consumption problem, you will not know it till you have clocked up some mileage. By the time you know, it is too late. How about coolant seeping into the combustion chamber slowly? It will be months later before the bike will give out smoke. Do you have recourse? Anwer is NO.

 

Therefore, please buy with care and ride safe.

Know shop that did something worse to the above TZM dude. Poor dude.

Coolant seeping into combustion chamber, u confirm cannot rev decently anymore. Remember to at least rev your bike.

 

 

All in all, buying from direct owners can be dangerous and risky too depending on your human skills to judge the person.

Buying from shop is even far far more dangerous as the dealer are much much more experience than you and if he ever decides to chop you, no matter how street smart of a person you are, you will be at the losing hand.

Are you from a bikeshop yourself? lol

Edited May 21, 2015 by guangwei

[guangwei]

Sharing my personal experience as a 1st timer 2B just passed rider hunting for bike.

 

As usual, sourcing for a bike of my choice within my budget. Arrange to go viewing. At CP, test ride short distance (50m), have a bit of feel of the bike, look c look c......

- Bike looks ok. just a bit of crack at the rear, looks ok to me.

- Ride feel, a bit off balance, can't tell if it's the rider or the bike, also its on those tiled type carpark... so I blame on me (the rider)

 

Then come my uncle, experienced biker, brought along a mechanics to help access the bike ..... OMG.....

When I test ride, can't feel much (the only experience I have is Driving centre bike which is pretty crap, during expressway familiarisation ride at 80+ km/h the bike vibrate till like going to fall apart......

Feedback.....

- Fork not balanced (seems like the bike experience some frontal accident, but can be fix, not $XXX, commented hopefully the rider who goot the accident is ok.... !!! @_@)

- Engine area (to me seems like simply dirty, but mech advice, engine gasket somewhere no good liao, got sign of slow leakage !!!)

- sprocket ware off liao. time to replace

- Chain might need replacement as well

- tyre harden liao, better to replace for safety

- brake working good... (heng)....

 

OMG.... Bike over priced as well as advice by both Mech and my uncle.... okie.....

 

End up I didn't buy the bike.

 

 

Lesson... if you have uncle/auntie or relatives or friends have been riding for a long time, experienced, know people who can advice or help, seriously seek their help or advice in getting your first 2nd hand bike.

Really more for safety and piece of mind riding.

SG road already not safe for biker with tonnes of car simply change lane without signal, squeeze or push us bikers from behind staying so bloody close for comfort........

 

So the last thing we want is a not reliable bike....

 

Just sharing my personal experience... ; )

The above 3 bolded quite easy to identify without testing. Fork not balance can be identified if u test ride. Engine area, did you whack? :/

Go to http://bikez.com/ find the bike model, check the max power output at certain xxx rpm, note down the max power rpm and go view the bike, the bike need to be able to whack to the max power rpm easily at least smoothly to be identified apparent fine. You dont need to whack his bike to red line tho. Thats all I know.

[guangwei]

There are weird people here who think that their bike has a lot of value even when coe left 1 to 2 yrs.by the way, there are also crook direct sellers asking shops to cheaply do n cover up the defects. Unsuspecting buyers will fall for it.

 

One guy say that buyers are smart. Not really true.. If not, we will not reading be tales of woe here.

 

Some bikes depreciate extremely slowly. RVF is 15 years old and its machince value is still 50% of what it was at retail 15 years ago.

Some SP250 are going passed 10k and people buys it. Hell RVF was going 7k-9k back then when I just passed 2A in 2013, with 5 years COE and people buys it.

Japanese bikes known to have longer lifespan than european bikes and popular model depreciate slower.

The value of bike does not always depend on COE years. COE have its own value. Bike machine have its own value.

 

Ducati depreciates faster from my quick observation. Maybe its becus its rare for european bikes to live past 2 COE cycles. Its very common for Honda bikes to go past 2 COE cycle. SP, CBR400RR, SP250. TZM, R6, R1.

 

However IMHO, the % of depreciation does not have a modelled fixed percentage, but there is a common trend that I notice is that the % of depreciation are usually determined in an exponential to lower value every year. Something like, the older the bikes goes, the slower the depreciation rate. I'm 100% sure its not a simple fix % like depreciates 15% of its retail value every year. lol ;/

 

Say a brand new bike to a 1 year bike, would depreciates by 25% of its value for the first year, but for the 1st year to the 2nd year of the bike lifespan, the depreciation would be at a lower depreciation rate at 20% of its value at 1 year old, then when you compare a 9 years old bike and a 10 years old bike, the depreciation would go slower and slower, say a 8 years old bike to 9 years old bike would by then properly depreciate by 10%, and a 9 years old bike would depreciate maybe just 8% of its value when it had transitted to 10 years old. However the unexpected sudden surge or fluctuation of COE bidding will affect how this theory works.

All this assuming the bike is a similar particular example you are using.

 

If you want a rough fomulae then its properly something something like % of depreciation = 25-1.5^n, (fomulae applies until % of depreciation drop to maybe 2% and the bike value is near 0)

where n is the age of the bike. This fomulae does not works for every bike, every bikes depreciates at a different rate depending on its popularity and rarity. Again this does not take into consideration the variety of COE changes during the bike's lifespan.

 

But but, from quick observation, europe bikes depreciates faster.

if the below fomulae, % of depreciation = 25-1.5^n works for certain popular japanese bike, than the fomulae, % of depreciation = 25-1.45^n would works for a certain popular european bike

(fomulae applies until % of depreciation drop to maybe 2% and the bike value is near 0)

Edited May 21, 2015 by guangwei

[mechwira]

Some bikes depreciate extremely slowly. RVF is 15 years old and its machince value is still 50% of what it was at retail 15 years ago.

Some SP250 are going passed 10k and people buys it. Hell RVF was going 7k-9k back then when I just passed 2A in 2013, with 5 years COE and people buys it.

Japanese bikes known to have longer lifespan than european bikes and popular model depreciate slower.

The value of bike does not always depend on COE years. COE have its own value. Bike machine have its own value.

 

Ducati depreciates faster from my quick observation. Maybe its becus its rare for european bikes to live past 2 COE cycles. Its very common for Honda bikes to go past 2 COE cycle. SP, CBR400RR, SP250. TZM, R6, R1.

 

However IMHO, the % of depreciation does not have a modelled fixed percentage, but there is a common trend that I notice is that the % of depreciation are usually determined in an exponential to lower value every year. Say a brand new bike to a 1 year bike, would depreciates by 25% of its value for the first year, but for the 1st year to the 2nd year of the bike lifespan, the depreciation would be at a lower depreciation rate at 15%, then when you compare a 9 years old bike and a 10 years old bike, the depreciation would be slower and slower, say a 8 years old bike to 9 years old bike would by then properly depreciate by 10%, and a 9 years old bike would depreciate maybe just 8% of its value.

All this assuming the bike is a similar particular example you are using.

 

But but, from quick observation, europe bikes depreciates faster.

 

hi bro.

 

interesting opinions. but we both agree depreciation is based on secondhand market value of the bike, which depends completely on market demand and definitely not zero upon ten years, yes? coz enuff explaining bike value not zero at ten years and depreciation not price divide by remaining coe. i also run out of words already...

 

with regards your claim % depreciation does not have modelled fixed percentage, i agree. one can only approximate. my numbers are also generalizations like yours. especially in current climate where COE very suddenly climb, market demand has been thrown out of whack. thats why people are paying for 6 year old hyundais for the same price as when the car was brand new 6 years ago, resulting in zero depreciation. it is impossible for anyone to determine exact figures. only shops which regularly sell secondhand vehicles can give the closest approximation, as the trend of secondhand prices is at their fingertips.

 

i oso agree that it is rarer to see conti bikes lasting beyond 2 COE cycles. but i'd like to suggest that this does not necessarily co-relate to its depreciation. as rare as these bikes are, so long as the much smaller numbers of enthusiasts pay a higher proportion of the original price of the conti compared to more common buyers buying japanese equivalents, then thats your indication of relative depreciation, not their rarity.

 

maybe if we compare depreciation of conti vs jap at twenty years, perhaps we see the jap now having a lower depreciation, because no enthusiast wants the conti anymore, resulting in the value being zero or close to zero. whereas common buyers still buy the jap bike, so the jap bike still has value. but i would be very surprised if we compare secondhand price of successfully sold conti vs jap bikes less than ten years, and we find the jap bikes hold their percentage value better than the conti. i would be very interested if you have evidence of this. otherwise, i am still more inclined to believe the conti has lower depreciation.

[mechwira]

The value of bike does not always depend on COE years. COE have its own value. Bike machine have its own value.

 

ah-ha. yes.

 

at ten years, if you choose to de-register bike and scrap, LTA pays you $0. its de-registration value is $0.

 

but if you choose to sell the bike at ten years, and on average your ten your old model successfully sells for maybe $4k, then the secondhand value of your bike is $4k. not $0. but if nobody wants to buy that bike, like a ten year old bajaj pulsar, its secondhand value would indeed be $0.

 

two different values, because two different options: de-register, or sell. and when we just say 'value', we always talk about its secondhand value. further, depreciation is based on secondhand value, not de-registration value.

[guangwei]

hi bro.

 

interesting opinions. but we both agree depreciation is based on secondhand market value of the bike, which depends completely on market demand and definitely not zero upon ten years, yes? coz enuff explaining bike value not zero at ten years and depreciation not price divide by remaining coe. i also run out of words already...

 

with regards your claim % depreciation does not have modelled fixed percentage, i agree. one can only approximate. my numbers are also generalizations like yours. especially in current climate where COE very suddenly climb, market demand has been thrown out of whack. thats why people are paying for 6 year old hyundais for the same price as when the car was brand new 6 years ago, resulting in zero depreciation. it is impossible for anyone to determine exact figures. only shops which regularly sell secondhand vehicles can give the closest approximation, as the trend of secondhand prices is at their fingertips.

 

i oso agree that it is rarer to see conti bikes lasting beyond 2 COE cycles. but i'd like to suggest that this does not necessarily co-relate to its depreciation. as rare as these bikes are, so long as the much smaller numbers of enthusiasts pay a higher proportion of the original price of the conti compared to more common buyers buying japanese equivalents, then thats your indication of relative depreciation, not their rarity.

 

maybe if we compare depreciation of conti vs jap at twenty years, perhaps we see the jap now having a lower depreciation, because no enthusiast wants the conti anymore, resulting in the value being zero or close to zero. whereas common buyers still buy the jap bike, so the jap bike still has value. but i would be very surprised if we compare secondhand price of successfully sold conti vs jap bikes less than ten years, and we find the jap bikes hold their percentage value better than the conti. i would be very interested if you have evidence of this. otherwise, i am still more inclined to believe the conti has lower depreciation.

 

I see people selling their near 20 years old RVF at close to 10k and it works after some negiotating, but I never know or commonly see any europe bike still sellable at 20 years old. :/

[mechwira]

I see people selling their near 20 years old RVF at close to 10k and it works after some negiotating, but I never know or commonly see any europe bike still sellable at 20 years old. :/

 

yeah bro. thats why i said perhaps at twenty years, maybe we see a reversal of the depreciation trend of conti vs jap. but i think comparing

 

also, i'd like to suggest that maybe the RVF is now unique in that it has been considered a 'collectible' and is therefore a one-off among jap bikes of twenty years. some bikes because of their history and reputation (regardless of make) become like this. i'll bet a Ductai 916 also has such a trend. and RS250. all considered collectibles and hold their value. not so for a GSX-R400 right?

 

 

i doubt we the same of most other twenty year old jap bikes.

[guangwei]

yeah bro. thats why i said perhaps at twenty years, maybe we see a reversal of the depreciation trend of conti vs jap. but i think comparing

 

At below 10 years old bike, and applying to my above said formulae, the % of depreciation are closer when comparing european bikes and jap bikes. the difference widen with age.

[guangwei]

yeah bro. thats why i said perhaps at twenty years, maybe we see a reversal of the depreciation trend of conti vs jap. but i think comparing

 

also, i'd like to suggest that maybe the RVF is now unique in that it has been considered a 'collectible' and is therefore a one-off among jap bikes of twenty years. some bikes because of their history and reputation (regardless of make) become like this. i'll bet a Ductai 916 also has such a trend. and RS250. all considered collectibles and hold their value. not so for a GSX-R400 right?

 

 

i doubt we the same of most other twenty year old jap bikes.

 

Some jap bikes do depreciate crazily fast too, like GSXR because suzuki completely abandons it, so I guess its hard to generalise which origin bikes depreciates faster. But a ducati 916 and RS250 is definitely noway as common as a CBR400RRR, RVF, and old spec1/2. You see there are more japanese bike that depreciates slow than europe bikes that depreciates slow.