Product : Engine Oil Discussion

[littlereddevil]

price cant be used as an indicator for quality. same as the food you eat and the clothes you wear.

[Isopropyl]

price is one of the indicator of a good quality oil. other then the high price of exotic addictive put into good engine oil, the oil base itself make up a bulk of the cost. for example Amsoil use group 4(PAO) oil base which is higher price then group 1-3 base oil. group 5(Ester) is the most expensive therefore many EO only use it to fortified other oil base. only a handful of EO use 100% ester I.E Motul.

 

the real question is does our daily usage require this level of protection which normally is design for extreme use like racing.

[Pandoras Kitten 3]

the real question is does our daily usage require this level of protection which normally is design for extreme use like racing.

 

I have asked myself that question before - synthetic oil for old 2B bike is at first glance WTF.

 

The answer to your question is yes, I need that level of protection, as this bike tends to run "hot and dry" at very high revs to reach highway speeds. Instead of tolerating a certain amount of oil consumption, I went with synthetic immediately after the break-in process.

 

The benefits of quiet running, zero oil consumption for the last 16,000kms and the ability to run a far more aggressive carburettor setting for maximum pickup makes the investment worthwhile.

 

The end decision lies in the individual rider/owner - while overfilling the Phantom's oil sump with a greater amount of engine oil (some have stated amounts of 1.5-2 litres because "it will eat oil anyway), I simply feel that new technology should be exploited to solve "yesterday"'s problems. It's a much better way to do things, as overfilling the sump means a greater internal pressure, and increased pumping drag on the motor, which saps power and creates a very jerky riding experience.

[crazydj]

Multiple posts. Let's move on with life. Honest mistake.

[crazydj]

The benefits of quiet running' date=' zero oil consumption for the last 16,000kms and the ability to run a far more aggressive carburettor setting for maximum pickup makes the investment worthwhile.[/quote']

 

Is that so? When i use synthetic oil, my oil get consumed faster, engine is noisier and very much easier to start in the morning. Better pick up but top speed remains pretty much the same. Fuel efficiency remains the same.

 

$3 Mineral EO vs. $25 Synthetic EO? That extra $22 doesn't give my bike significant performance gains.

 

The moral of the story? Every bike and rider is different.

[Isopropyl]

Is that so? When i use synthetic oil, my oil get consumed faster, engine is noisier and very much easier to start in the morning. Better pick up but top speed remains pretty much the same. Fuel efficiency remains the same.

 

$3 Mineral EO vs. $25 Synthetic EO? That extra $22 doesn't give my bike significant performance gains.

 

The moral of the story? Every bike and rider is different.

 

i have heard similar story too. about synthetic giving problems.

 

may i know what oil did you use that give problem and the weight? maybe you can try another brand and a *W50 grade.

[Isopropyl]

I have asked myself that question before - synthetic oil for old 2B bike is at first glance WTF.

 

maybe next time someone can organise a oil change outing. we can try the carlube oil together. haha..

 

other then the carlube, i am thinking of getting Amsoil AMO from Mxtradings @ $16.50. Cheap and one of the very better EO out there.

[crazydj]

i have heard similar story too. about synthetic giving problems.

 

may i know what oil did you use that give problem and the weight? maybe you can try another brand and a *W50 grade.

 

No la. The synthetic oil doesnt give me problems. Its just that, for the slight performance difference, i don't see the need to spend so much on fully synthetic oil for older 2B bikes.

 

On an old YBR125:-

 

Maxima Maxum4 Extra 10W-40 (Fully Synthetic)

- Noisy engine

- Easier to start in the morning

- Slightly better pickup

- Gets used up fast

 

Maxima Maxum4 Blend 10W-40 (Semi Synthetic)

- Same as the above but all reduced slightly.

 

UNCLUBE 4T (Cheapest Mineral Oil from Ah Boy)

- Engine not so noisy

- Hard to start in the morning (Old bike ah)

- Pickup not as fast as fully syn oils (Few secs difference)

- Does not get used up as fast

[Pandoras Kitten 3]

maybe next time someone can organise a oil change outing. we can try the carlube oil together. haha..

 

other then the carlube, i am thinking of getting Amsoil AMO from Mxtradings @ $16.50. Cheap and one of the very better EO out there.

 

Let me know when you're going, my OCI is coming up soon. HKL is selling that for 24, but 16.5 is a very good price for a quality synthetic from a race-proven company.

[Isopropyl]

Let me know when you're going' date=' my OCI is coming up soon. HKL is selling that for 24, but 16.5 is a very good price for a quality synthetic from a race-proven company.[/quote']

 

the $24 is the MCF or MCV version which sell for $22 at Mxtradings. for the $16.50 is the AMO or ARO version. The different between the more expensive EO over the cheaper EO is the oil additive package. from an Amsoil dealer, he mentioned that the cheaper version actually contain more group 5(Ester) oil base. not sure how true is it.

 

for your bike, i think a 50weight will be better. so you might want to try either MCV or ARO. Amsoil make one of the better EO out there if not the best. check up its white paper. Although done by Amsoil through a third party, no EO company had step forward to dispute or challenge the result so far.

 

MCF 10W40

MCV 20W50

AMO 10W40

ARO 20W50

[I_Ride_A_Bike]

the $24 is the MCF or MCV version which sell for $22 at Mxtradings. for the $16.50 is the AMO or ARO version. The different between the more expensive EO over the cheaper EO is the oil additive package. from an Amsoil dealer, he mentioned that the cheaper version actually contain more group 5(Ester) oil base. not sure how true is it.

 

for your bike, i think a 50weight will be better. so you might want to try either MCV or ARO. Amsoil make one of the better EO out there if not the best. check up its white paper. Although done by Amsoil through a third party, no EO company had step forward to dispute or challenge the result so far.

 

MCF 10W40

MCV 20W50

AMO 10W40

ARO 20W50

 

this is interesting... must try out this brand of oil to know how well it performs..

especially bikes ridden for prolong hours each day on long touring trips...

[I_Ride_A_Bike]

Let me know when you're going' date=' my OCI is coming up soon. HKL is selling that for 24, but 16.5 is a very good price for a quality synthetic from a race-proven company.[/quote']

 

you change your own engine oil? can buy and do together at some quiet place.

let me know when you guys are buying the Amsoil oil... if free, will join.

[Pandoras Kitten 3]

@Isopropyl - thanks, MCV's specifications look impressive.

 

As for the neverending debate of petroleum oil vs synthetic, here's what an oil engineer has to say (a good summary is in Page 47 onwards of this "Motor Oil Bible": http://www.llens.net/pdfs/motor-oil-bible.pdf)

 

Of course, the actual, real world benefits depend on the machine in question and its usage. For instance, I find Castrol 10W40 perfectly adequate for short distance, low speed off-highway trips in average/below average temperatures.

 

I'm the sort of person who rides and makes a point of memorising the feel and sound of individual components within the engine bay. Castrol mineral just does not offer any protection for my machine's valvetrain at highway speeds and audibly simply foams up when stressed giving no defense against metal-metal contact.

 

But when it comes to using the bike for high acceleration, extended range cruising at highway speeds in high temperature noon to midday conditions, good synthetics are plain awesome. Not to mention, the cold start protection is fantastic.

 

(Ps: I've had riders try Maxima oil and they reported for the most part mediocre performance/smoothness, and high oil consumption)

Edited December 17, 2010 by Pandora's Kitten :3

[Isopropyl]

 

UNCLUBE 4T (Cheapest Mineral Oil from Ah Boy)

i was just wondering whether does anyone really use that stuff for their engine at the first place:p

 

i am using $3 UNCLUBE 2T as a chain lube. most likely make up of some group 1 bases with bits of additives added. it don't even feel "slick" when rubbed between fingers. but i guess it should be good enough for chain if it can help an engine to survive. can it? haha...

[Pandoras Kitten 3]

i was just wondering whether does anyone really use that stuff for their engine at the first place:p

 

i am using $3 UNCLUBE 2T as a chain lube. most likely make up of some group 1 bases with bits of additives added. it don't even feel "slick" when rubbed between fingers. but i guess it should be good enough for chain if it can help an engine to survive. can it? haha...

 

I think with lower power "equipment" the lubricating properties of the famous LAB "uncle lube" would be adequate, just as mineral EO's properties may be adequate for a low compression, light-workload engine.

 

But up the ante and we either sacrifice protection or oil longevity. Motul 3100 was a great oil but I can destroy that in under 600kms

[blackant]

How about trying the Xrev racing 4T?

http://www.singaporebikes.com/component/content/article/1-latest-announcements/84-xrev-zerofriction-racing-4t

 

I just changed to it and notice dropped in temperature.

[Isopropyl]

How about trying the Xrev racing 4T?

http://www.singaporebikes.com/component/content/article/1-latest-announcements/84-xrev-zerofriction-racing-4t

 

I just changed to it and notice dropped in temperature.

 

i not too confidence of their product. it a reletive new company and there are some information online mentioning their advertised approved rating actally is not been approved.

 

either they are been misleading or someone forget to add their brand on the list.

 

i stick with something with better track record. also the price is a bit on the high side. it cost $32?

[runjoerun]

I have tried on my almost 10 year old Super 4 Spec 1 the following EO and a few remarks on the more popular brands and types base on my butt feel as they said it. All EO replaced at 5,000 km altho Honda recommended 12,000 km.

 

Motul 300V Factory Line 10W-40

Engine and gearbox quiet and engine perform satisfactory

 

Maxima Maxum4 Extra 15W-50

Engine and gearbox very quiet but engine performance below satisfatory (maybe the thicker oil)

 

Amsoil 10W-40

Engine and gearbox quiet but engine perform below satisfactory

 

Chex 9000 15W-50

Engine and gearbox quiet and engine perform satisfactory

 

I was more than suprised when I first used Chex9000. It doesn't feels like is a 15W-50, it feels like I'm using a far thinner oil. I was skeptical at first. This is after all a local brand and on the can it printed 'made in Germany' even tho not selling in Germany. Currently I'm already into my 2nd Chex oil change. If not for the hefty price tag of the Factory Line, I'll still continue to use Motul.

[Pandoras Kitten 3]

I had the same feeling with Chex. It might be some ersatz (generic) product from Germany but the Germans know some things we don't about perfection in engineering.

 

My oil consumption is absolutely zero. Zilch. Nada. On a bike model that is infamous for "eating oil" due to high RPM (I have NO rev limiter!) and high running temperatures.

[Isopropyl]

i wanted to try Chex9000 too. only reason i holding back is because of the 50w.

 

i riding a cub with watercooling so a 40w should be better.

[RxzDelux]

i wanted to try Chex9000 too. only reason i holding back is because of the 50w.

 

i riding a cub with watercooling so a 40w should be better.

 

Bro, my FZ150i is also liquid cooled bike. Had personally tried the Chex9000 10W50. Quite good i could say.

[Isopropyl]

Bro, my FZ150i is also liquid cooled bike. Had personally tried the Chex9000 10W50. Quite good i could say.

 

damn. you guys are good at convincing people.

 

recently i am very much into homebrew chainlube with synthetic engine oil. testing some formula now. just love homebrew. haha...

[Pandoras Kitten 3]

damn. you guys are good at convincing people.

 

recently i am very much into homebrew chainlube with synthetic engine oil. testing some formula now. just love homebrew. haha...

 

Homebrew chainlube - if you got the 'secret formulae' I will design a spray on version for those of us with cruisers w/o main stand

[Isopropyl]

nay. it all over the net. it the legendary "homebrew progold". synthetic engine oil mix with a solvent like mineral spirts aka thinner. i still playing around with the formula ratio.

 

the standard formula is 1part 30w synthetic EO mix with 3part solvent. people are using from 2-10parts solvent to 1part EO of different weight. so it up to one to decide what work best. currently i am using 1part 40w EO to 2parts solvent which i find is already very watery. it have about 30% lubricant.

 

2 main reasons for the formula. firstly, the high amount of solvent dissovle dirt and clean the chain. dirt have the action of grinding the chain. secondly, most chain lube or oil is too thick to go around the plates and pins of standard heavy duty chain. solvent is a good penetrating oil and evapourate super fast leaving behind a good layer of high quality EO at where the chain need it most. if you need a third reason, it super cheap!!!

 

there are so many forumla out there. some even use the good old Marvel Mystery Oil as solvent or Ester-based EO which bind to metal surface. i find it expensive so just use left over amsoil EO plus a bottle of $3 thinner. cheapskate i know:p

[Pandoras Kitten 3]

That must be the coolest thing I've read all year