Hdb new flat now expensive/cheap/ok

[Pplater]

Precisely. U see, HDB can solve the housing shortage problem if they want. 20x oversubscribe can be solved, if they want to. Probably they want to keep it at 6 to 10x oversubscribe, just to keep things humming along. but of course, sometimes they c*** up and end up with 20x oversubscribe.

 

My point is that HDB prices are fixed, especially BTO. They won't make it cheap because they have to please the majority property owners for votes.

 

The new buyers, once they bought, its in their interest to see resale prices sustained.

 

The gahmen will always want to please the majority to stay in power.

 

So each generation will pile pressure onto the next generation to buy at high prices and keep the prices up. Until something gives eventually.

 

After all, aren't everyone most concerned about how they make ends meet?

 

As much as I want prices to remain at least at the levels I bought my flat for, I wouldn't mind if they didn't go sky high. I don't mind if I don't make a fortune from flipping my HDB flat. I just want a place to stay in. It goes sky high, I sell high, I have to buy at high prices again.

 

And I think its this group of people like me who want an affordable HDB flat to stay in and not flip for profits which the gahmen really p*ssed off the last GE.

Edited June 20, 2011 by Pplater

[JackOHJack]

in hk, everyone flip until happy, those who bankrupt - their own biz.

 

in sg, it's "controlled flipping", so not too many bankrupt.. perhaps in this light it's good that the undergahmen put 1 leg in..

 

anyw, e idea now is to increase our pay across the board ma, see can "make ends meet" or not lor.. wait, they promised to increase the pay, but they nv say they wun increase housing more than the pay increment! hahaz, still lppl.

[Pplater]

U see, in my mother's time, a HDB flat went for 6k. The pioneer batch. She was a teacher with partial A levels. Her pay was 300+, meaning 20 months wages for the flat.

 

Times have changed, 4 rooms flats are 100 months wages for a teacher, or SCDF/army/navy/air force officer.

 

U say should buay song or not?

[Pplater]

every generation has been piling on pressure on the next. The escalating housing prices, not my problem. The inflation, not my problem. The rising cost of living faster than real wage growth, not my problem. Something has to give sooner or later. And I think Singapore will eventually move towards US dual party system. PAP vs Workers' Party.

 

Only thing is I dunno whether that is a good thing. What do u think?

[cougar]

every generation has been piling on pressure on the next. The escalating housing prices, not my problem. The inflation, not my problem. The rising cost of living faster than real wage growth, not my problem. Something has to give sooner or later. And I think Singapore will eventually move towards US dual party system. PAP vs Workers' Party.

 

Only thing is I dunno whether that is a good thing. What do u think?

 

as long as the inflation is self inflicted to the benefit of the elite few, its a bad thing. I dont see how many party can affect our quality of life. Its not the number of party, its the administration is lame.

[cougar]

U see, in my mother's time, a HDB flat went for 6k. The pioneer batch. She was a teacher with partial A levels. Her pay was 300+, meaning 20 months wages for the flat.

 

Times have changed, 4 rooms flats are 100 months wages for a teacher, or SCDF/army/navy/air force officer.

 

U say should buay song or not?

 

last time govt never give millions of free citizenship to boost demand. Parliament dont have so many mouths to suck. Dont have extra costs like erp, gst in cause inflation, every biz is upping prices to cover these erp, gst indirect costs that make life difficult. Thanks leh pap.

[SparkerS1]

back then was it 100x or 200x undersupply? And they solved it in those times? And now u telling me, 20X cannot solve?

Back in the past, huge plots of lands are available for new housing estates. Population not as much as compared presently. Now with the huge influx of PR and FT, how are we going to accomodate them?

 

Currently land is limited, old buildings are en-bloc for new HDBs, more forested areas; Yishun, Punggol, Fernvale etc coming up BTOs but with current demands, it will never be enough to cater.

 

Unless you want Singapore to be fully urbanized for housing needs, for example the whole of Mandai forested area , Bishan park, Mac Ritchie Park etc cleared for HDB housing? Urbanized Pulau Ubin?

 

My point is that HDB prices are fixed, especially BTO. They won't make it cheap because they have to please the majority property owners for votes.

Some factors to add on.

HDB is priced based on land rental price, workmanship, quality and materials.

 

SG employs foreign workers to build for us, one worker's salary is not much but consider the thousands of workers working their lifes off for giving us the place we called home. Would anyone willing to draw a salary lower than them and work more than them?

 

Quality of materials and skilled workers increases with better technology and in-depth of knowledge. Bottomline is You pay for quality.

 

Raw Materials are limited and don't come cheap, SG don't have any natural resources and need to import them. SG don't reclaim land out of nowhere.

 

All these cost money, with currency inflation and increasing standard of living, We have to move on and not living in the past.

 

I am just looking at this issue as a neutral party, hope no hard feelings.

If you have better solutions, why not share or even propose to HDB, it not just benefit you, it can solve the nation's housing shortage problem.

 

And I think Singapore will eventually move towards US dual party system. PAP vs Workers' Party.

 

Only thing is I dunno whether that is a good thing. What do u think?

 

It's a good thing to have some competition and contribute together to the future success and progession of SG

[Silent Hunter]

I will share my solutions, provided I take over as minister and get his pay. Why should I share my ideas when I am not paid for them? It's my intellect property.

[Yatz86]

Some factors to add on.

HDB is priced based on land rental price, workmanship, quality and materials.

 

SG employs foreign workers to build for us, one worker's salary is not much but consider the thousands of workers working their lifes off for giving us the place we called home. Would anyone willing to draw a salary lower than them and work more than them?

 

Quality of materials and skilled workers increases with better technology and in-depth of knowledge. Bottomline is You pay for quality.

 

Raw Materials are limited and don't come cheap, SG don't have any natural resources and need to import them. SG don't reclaim land out of nowhere.

 

All these cost money, with currency inflation and increasing standard of living, We have to move on and not living in the past.

 

I am just looking at this issue as a neutral party, hope no hard feelings.

If you have better solutions, why not share or even propose to HDB, it not just benefit you, it can solve the nation's housing shortage problem.

 

True the rising indirect cost have affected and contributed to the rising of prices in new HDB flats.

 

However, without the specific breakdown of the cost of building flats, the cost of land, and other additional costs, it may be impossible to determine how much profit, if any is made when the HDB makes from the sale of flats.

 

And have you seen HDB financial report figures? It's damn confusing and hard to understand where the figures are derived and what the entry in each line consists of....its as if they dont want u to understand it....

 

at the end of the day, hdb flat aint cheap...its not even considered ures even when u bought it...This is cause you have no real property rights as HDB buyer. There is no such thing as HDB title deed. There is only HDB Agreement For Lease document, in which you are the lessee (tenant) and the HDB is the lessor (landlord). As HDB buyer, you have zero strata-title land rights --- the land still belongs to HDB. Thus pls dont consider hdb as ure asset and just merely a place to rest ure head.

[cougar]

In other words, we are not bumiputra, we pay extra for housing, no protection for jobs, education, treated like a bunch of suckers. For those who luv this island, good luck.

[cougar]

Why the stock market falling now and yet housing and car prices still up?

[Jehuty]

Back in the past, huge plots of lands are available for new housing estates. Population not as much as compared presently. Now with the huge influx of PR and FT, how are we going to accomodate them?

 

 

Yeah, land is scarce in Singapore is understood hence why housing here is expensive, know Singapore like that why still bring in huge numbers of FTs and drive up prices even more? Everything points to an eventual collapse. Only way is to build taller flats lor or dig underground...or demolish golf courses and build flats.

[pyro13]

I tink recession is coming soon. However, price of flats will still sustain.

[Frostb3ar]

And have you seen HDB financial report figures? It's damn confusing and hard to understand where the figures are derived and what the entry in each line consists of....its as if they dont want u to understand it....

 

at the end of the day, hdb flat aint cheap...its not even considered ures even when u bought it...This is cause you have no real property rights as HDB buyer. There is no such thing as HDB title deed. There is only HDB Agreement For Lease document, in which you are the lessee (tenant) and the HDB is the lessor (landlord). As HDB buyer, you have zero strata-title land rights --- the land still belongs to HDB. Thus pls dont consider hdb as ure asset and just merely a place to rest ure head.

 

For the HDB financial reports, please do not exclude the auditors who have played a really significant part in generating the report. I think the auditors are either one of the big 4 - EY, PWC, KPMG or Deloitte ...

 

Firstly, from my perspective, I do have real property rights and they are set out in the terms of the Agreement to Lease, which HDB and I have contracted into. I dont necessarily need to own the land in order to have lawful property rights, and I do not necessarily need to own the land before i can lawfully sell those property rights to another person in the market.

 

And it is this right to sell and the fact that there are ready available buyers (offering reasonable prices) for my 'property right' in the market that I consider it my asset. Basically whatever tangible or intangible right which belongs to me and that has value, is my asset.

 

If you are so keen to delineate property rights according to who owns the land and who doesnt ... then you might want to prepare yourself to offer in the very least 1 million to buy some small plot of land in some corner of Singapore.

 

But i would rather use that same 1 million to invest in an apartment in the middle of Singapore ...

[GuiNNeSS]

I am really upset.

 

1st I ballot for singles BTO 2 rooms 6 times. The 7th time.....suddenly out of the blue, HDB wrote to me to tell me they have leftover 2rooms, that I can choose from. And when I agree, they had to cancel my 7th time ballot. Ok Fine....its only $10.

 

And throughtout the application. Because of one month in March, for the Twelve Month before I got 'lucky' with the ballot. I had to go down to HDB 3 times to Sumpah, that I was working as a freelance tourguide and thus without any CPF.

 

I got fed up finally and request for them to terminate the application of my singles grant of $11k.

 

Surprisingly, when I went to HDB to sign for my unit later, they also cancelled my hdb loan. They say its the same process.

 

I did a quick calculation, and realise that I do have enough in my CPF, even though most of it was in Investments. So I think still ok. If I dont break out some investment link to keep the high profit....I only need a 20k.

 

I still was trying to get housing loans from banks. But they say they do not offer bank loans for HDB2 rooms.

 

And when I tried to break my CPF investments to make sure there will be enough for them to deduct for the flat.

 

The wordings on the forms, indicate that I must only be 55 years above, or on medical grounds, or is relinquishing my Spore citizenship.

 

Meaning farking hell.....cannot break the investments.....

[GuiNNeSS]

So now. I am neither here or there.

 

I need a full 60k in my CPF, or has a bank loan for 60K.

 

They cannot classified it as Housing Loan, or even Refinance Mortage Loan, because banks needs such loans to be in excess of 100/200k.

 

My unit is only 90+k.

 

And I cannot classify as Personal Loans, because they can only loan up to 6 times of my monthly Salary. Which makes it that I am still short of $40k!

 

I am totally neither here nor there with this one. And add insult to injury. Where I looked thru the HDB website with their Frequent Q & A.

 

It says, if you cannot get bank loans or have sufficient in your OA. You are really not qualified to buy a HDB and should just rent from HDB.

 

I am a blardy single, with no family nucleus. Which makes me ineligible to rent a HDB. And my income level does not permit me to rent from HDB direct.

[haoKR]

wa sis, old tread leh..

But no deposit has been made on any flat right?

[GuiNNeSS]

wa sis, old tread leh..

But no deposit has been made on any flat right?

 

Considered Deposited. $11.5k already deducted from my CPF.

 

I even have the unit number, floor plan already.

 

The flat should be completed early, some of us in the facebook group was told that it could handover to us as early as end this year and March next year.

 

The scheduled on paper handover is September 2017.

 

Thats why I am now kiasu, trying to make sure there is no sudden surprises.

 

My block is completed, and so is the half dozen of blocks. Even the roads and park connectors are opened up now, and the landscape is more of less completed.

 

The building picture you see, is taken in January 2016.

[MR BIKER]

see MP i am sure no use.

1) maybe you have no permanent address

I feel for you VK. hope you can solve this problem.

I am surprised why you cant sell back your investment. Why must reach 55?

I have some in my investment, and i may lose out abit but if I desperate i can easily sell my investment and put the amount back into my OA again even though I have not reach 55.

[GuiNNeSS]

I have some in my investment, and i may lose out abit but if I desperate i can easily sell my investment and put the amount back into my OA again even though I have not reach 55.

 

Thats what I am thinking too! Which is why instead of delaying the signing of accepting of the flat, to look for a loan. I went ahead with the signing instead of having to wait donkey months.

 

But the sentences are like so rigid! Will have to drop by CPF one day this month, to get the investments out. Have to tackle this step by step. Hopefully, with the bulk of money back in the OA. I can beg borrow and steal cash to top up before the handover.

 

And pray hard for a Toto windfall!

[wait4me]

wooo goodjob HDB,

 

inserting KJ comment s hahahah h

[haoKR]

Considered Deposited. $11.5k already deducted from my CPF.

 

I even have the unit number, floor plan already.

 

The flat should be completed early, some of us in the facebook group was told that it could handover to us as early as end this year and March next year.

 

The scheduled on paper handover is September 2017.

 

Thats why I am now kiasu, trying to make sure there is no sudden surprises.

 

My block is completed, and so is the half dozen of blocks. Even the roads and park connectors are opened up now, and the landscape is more of less completed.

 

The building picture you see, is taken in January 2016.

 

ok, that is for the first downpayment right. And the other one is to be make before you get the keys.

But the bto is still under your name, without the grant?

[GuiNNeSS]

ok, that is for the first downpayment right. And the other one is to be make before you get the keys.

But the bto is still under your name, without the grant?

 

Yuppers. Under my only name. Without the Grant, and without a HDB Loan, and without a Bank Loan.

 

Need to go find a 60k somewhere somehow. Sigh. And its now made worse, by my current employer not wanting to help.

 

I requested for a steady CPF contribution to maintain a high amount going in for the next six months or so. Even offering to pay in cash whatever shortfall just so that it will look like the CPF contributed is high enough for banks to reconsider my case.

 

CPF, if I break all my CPF Investments.......kay fine....it will leave me totally debt free from HDB. And the Gahment can go screw themselves for the minimum sum when I hit 55.

 

Because if I can, I will not be contributing to CPF.

 

Oh....in answer your question. No....there isnt another deposit to pay when I get my keys. I have to pay the full remaining sum in one shot before they will give me the keys.

[haoKR]

Yuppers. Under my only name. Without the Grant, and without a HDB Loan, and without a Bank Loan.

 

Need to go find a 60k somewhere somehow. Sigh. And its now made worse, by my current employer not wanting to help.

 

I requested for a steady CPF contribution to maintain a high amount going in for the next six months or so. Even offering to pay in cash whatever shortfall just so that it will look like the CPF contributed is high enough for banks to reconsider my case.

 

CPF, if I break all my CPF Investments.......kay fine....it will leave me totally debt free from HDB. And the Gahment can go screw themselves for the minimum sum when I hit 55.

 

Because if I can, I will not be contributing to CPF.

 

Oh....in answer your question. No....there isnt another deposit to pay when I get my keys. I have to pay the full remaining sum in one shot before they will give me the keys.

 

So when is your flat coming, or should i say when do you need to pay the remaining sum.

[kzone]

Thats what I am thinking too! Which is why instead of delaying the signing of accepting of the flat, to look for a loan. I went ahead with the signing instead of having to wait donkey months.

 

But the sentences are like so rigid! Will have to drop by CPF one day this month, to get the investments out. Have to tackle this step by step. Hopefully, with the bulk of money back in the OA. I can beg borrow and steal cash to top up before the handover.

 

And pray hard for a Toto windfall!

 

who did u invest with? I don't think going to CPF will work. U will need to meet with the company that u bought the investment from and