Disappointed with new 2b bikes in local market

[Pluvius]

Nowadays the new 4 stroke 2b bikes in the market have better fuel consumption but cruising speed, top speed, pick-up are affected. I feel buyers should think twice when they buy these bikes.

 

Example: R15 top speed 140, cruising speed, around 90-100. Pulsar 180, top speed 115-120, cruising speed 80 as revealed by a member selling his 2nd hand bike in the garage sales section. Pulsar 200, only slightly higher top speed at 125 with cruising speed barely reaching 100. These facts have been confirmed with official specs of the bikes and people.

 

Pick-up wise, I won't comment much because bike manufacturers smart enough to think of several alternatives to compensate the loss of power of a 4 stroke as compared to 2 stroke although some 4 stroke 2b bikes pick up are still not good. (This explains why some parts are multiplied by 2 or by 4)

 

I just feel that such bikes are unsuitable for long expressways rides where a minimum of 100 km/h is needed and recommended 110km/h for "situations". These are just my own figures from observing which my friends also agree.

 

Yeah true, expressway speed limit generally 90km/h, some 80km/h (don't quote Nicoll Highway to me) but in reality, cars will frequently go more than that, at around 100km/h agree? Consider a Saturday or Sunday evening/night. You have to agree that people don't follow the normal road limit of 50km/h right? The same applies to expressway. If possible (no jams), cars will go above the expressway limit of 90. Agree?

 

Now, imagine if you are traveling at 80km/h cruising speed with your Pulsar at middle lane, high chance, you will encounter cars tailgating you, flashing headlights and cutting your lane abruptly to show their anger. Not just one car, but a series of car will continue to share lanes with your bike even though your bike is in the centre of the lane while overtaking to share their anger. If you move to the side of the lane while travelling at 80-90 to let the car overtake you easily or share lane with you, you are putting yourself in risk (defensive riding) These big cars owners are the worst. They will do many nasty thing like trying to grind you.

 

Maybe I am the only one seeing this happen to fellow motorcyclist or encountering it but I do personally know car drivers who purposely tailgate slower vehicles in front to pressure them to go faster or get out of the lane. My cousin is one of them, whom I don't agree with him.

 

But at the speed of 80-90, the expressway left lane is not a good lane for motorcycles for obvious reasons (laden with trucks). Of course, the motorcyclist may choose to linger at the lane marker between 2 lanes indefinitely but puts himself at risk if he do so for a very long time and at specific spots (fork at end of AYE, left goes to ECP/Tanjong Pagar, right goes to CTE).

 

Some will say whats the big deal? Just open throttle to 110km/h with your new 2b 4 stroke bike and keep up with the traffic. Very soon, you will have a heap load of problems with your stressed bike (pulsar especially).

 

Some will say I have never encountered or see this before? Thus, I ask you to ride your bike at 80 or 90 at middle lane at AYE or ECP and see if you have bad car drivers tailgating you or abruptly lane cutting you or grinding you. Similar situation here is when the normal road speed limit is 50 or 60 and when you follow the speed limit, you will find many big and heavily modded cars doing the same to you in anger. Try riding at 60 at normal roads, you will find heavily modded Integras, Civics and Lancers doing something funny to you.

 

Ok, maybe you find this thread a waste of time but I wish the reader good luck if he think he is safe at 90km/h on the expressway because I do know for sure if you follow the speed limit on the expressway or main road, you will be high risk of accident. The new 2b bikes 4 stroke are potential risk bearers.

 

Just my newbie humble opinion

[zyrofillica]

so your point is that every 2b holder shd get a SP or kips (top speed 180) so that their risk of accident will be minimal?

[heskeydal]

chill man... the reason having bike which categorize into 2b, 2a ,2 is because of technical handle of the biker. If 2B bike is having higher top speed and cruising speed, inexperience of controlling of bike will happen, which will also caused accident. If wan higher speed and power i think u shld take up class 2a liao....

[dotless]

lol. why is he complaining?

[qd]

lol. why is he complaining?

 

i dun noe y. mayb boring, nothing to do..

[aRcHeR]

2b, ride so fast for what?

 

dun how to walk properly yet wan to fly. dun drive up our insurance premium, can?

[deckard]

wall of text man, can summarise ???

[heskeydal]

i tink mainly.... 2b is slow. fullstop~

[dotless]

haha.2b only what. how fast he want. don't talk about 2-stroke bikes. wait! is he suggesting that we dont have any 4stroke 2b bikes and all 2-stroke 2b bikes? wah. i no money to buy aprilia leh. and honda sp abit too old ah. i scared.

[red rocket]

Hey TS,

 

Simple solution.... Just get out of the way. not very hard to do right? I do share your emotions, however you and I do not own the highways and public roads. how do you know the person in the car is not drunk! Pride and ego will bring you down.

 

It's not worth the risk if you get into an accident, no matter who has the right of way. Bikers are ALWAYS at the losing end. Drivers can say "sorry I hit you, I'm at fault ,you can claim my insurance". will that make you feel better? what if you need to have a limb amputated?

 

Are you reading this?

[Pluvius]

Hi, thanks for reading.

 

@zyro- Nope, I am not saying that if you have higher top speeds, accidents will be minimal. That is a fallacy. It still depends on other factors as well for an accident to happen. But you will avoid these cars from doing monkey business to you from the back and side at the expressway if you travel at a fast enough speed which nowadays the new bikes cannot give at their cruising speed where they won't stress their bike. Neither am I advocating any models like KIPS OR NSR SP in specific. Perhaps, I wasn't clear in my point or it was misinterpreted. But you have to agree that travelling at such speeds on expressways and main roads will pose risks right?

 

@heskey, 2A all along I had it some years back. Class 3 also, Class 4 also. Just that now never ride big bike or drive car or lorry. Again, accident happens is because of many factors. I refer to your 2 step claim, "higher top speeds and cruising speeds leads to inexperience of controlling of bike that leads to accident." It does not necessarily apply universally. So many factors lead to the good/bad control of bike and accident. Does higher top speeds and cruising speed really leads to inexperienced, bad control of the bike? Are you for certain that top speed and cruising speed is a significant or sole contributor to accidents? What if I tell you that higher top speed and cruising speed barely leads to this, it depends more on the individual rider and other motorists on the road and riding conditions?

 

Am I right to say by your claims that governments in the world including Singapore are exposing their citizens to accidents by allowing such bikes in the past and currently? No, they are not. Because the government knows that top speed and cruising speed are not sole and primary factors of bad, inexperienced control and accidents. Yes I agree that amongst other considerations like the technical handling experience they have divided the Class of bike license into 2, 2A and 3 unlike the olden system where pass bike license means can ride any cc. So just fruit for thought, why are our 2b motorcycles being nerfed?

 

@dotless, not complaining. Just sharing my humble opinions that I am disappointed with the motorcycles for sale currently as this is what the section for this forum for. I believe this is the correct forum as per description (Bikes and Bytes).

 

My humble opinion is that you need to ride at a fast enough speed (at least 100 km/h) on the expressways which current Class 2b 4 Stroke bikes for sale don't give unless you stress them which I am disappointed.

 

I am not suggesting every 2b rider should buy a KIPS or NSR SP (top speed 180).

 

Many thanks for replying. But keep it cool, its open discussion.

[Pandoras Kitten 3]

You can optimise your 2B for higher than stock cruising speed. Sprockets, weight reduction, some tuning, hunker down really low and risk derogatory stares... sometimes the bike is just optimised for city riding which is why they're shipped with close gear ratios, etc.

 

But I can agree with the pickup bit. I recently test rode a souped up X1-R and my first feedback was... my 7 yr old 125Z is so much more powerful.

 

But not on all bikes - Yamaha Spark although 4 stroke is faster than 125Z and possibly an improvement in terms of other factors too. Such as reliability, FC and refinement.

 

As for cruising speed - I'm happy to say I bought a bike that has a max. speed of 100kph... because I got a reallllly big rear sprocket that gives quite tremendous in gear acceleration within non-highway speeds. On the highways I just keep to the left or middle lane and overtake only if I will not block anyone's way.

 

Didn't buy Phantom to speed, although I'm just a sprocket/gearing change away to get the cruising speed from 90 to 110 eventually.

[Pluvius]

Hey TS,

 

Simple solution.... Just get out of the way. not very hard to do right? I do share your emotions, however you and I do not own the highways and public roads. how do you know the person in the car is not drunk! Pride and ego will bring you down.

 

It's not worth the risk if you get into an accident, no matter who has the right of way. Bikers are ALWAYS at the losing end. Drivers can say "sorry I hit you, I'm at fault ,you can claim my insurance". will that make you feel better? what if you need to have a limb amputated?

 

Are you reading this?

 

Yes this one i agree, get out of the way. But how many times can you get out of the way? I have none of the above mentioned pride and ego you mentioned and I always get out of the way. But sometimes things happen.

[bernardk]

Hey TS,

 

Simple solution.... Just get out of the way. not very hard to do right? I do share your emotions, however you and I do not own the highways and public roads. how do you know the person in the car is not drunk! Pride and ego will bring you down.

 

It's not worth the risk if you get into an accident, no matter who has the right of way. Bikers are ALWAYS at the losing end. Drivers can say "sorry I hit you, I'm at fault ,you can claim my insurance". will that make you feel better? what if you need to have a limb amputated?

 

Are you reading this?

 

Well said and exactly wat i wanna say.

To me 2B team triangle rider usually have the mindset as they are fast.

When after they taste the tarmac more often then they will knw that so wat if its fast but unsafe. With greater power comes greater responsibility.

 

No choice since 2B only stuck with 200CC and below. Everyone have to go thru this. Learn to be patient and learn to be safe for yourself. Not learn how to overtake ppl at fast speed. Throttle only everyone also knw now to twist full. But do you knw how to stop fast?

[Pluvius]

haha.2b only what. how fast he want. don't talk about 2-stroke bikes. wait! is he suggesting that we dont have any 4stroke 2b bikes and all 2-stroke 2b bikes? wah. i no money to buy aprilia leh. and honda sp abit too old ah. i scared.

 

Constructive talk please. Don't imply or say that I'm suggesting or this when I didn't. Thank you. Keep it cool.

[red rocket]

Unfortunately my Sachs Madass 125 can only manage 80km/h. never had anyone tried to help me go faster using their bumper.

 

Speed is not the answer

Edited May 7, 2010 by red rocket
Quotes removed

[Pluvius]

I think people are already misunderstanding what I am saying and accusing me of suggesting things that I did not. I am not some sort of speed addict with a 2b bike as accused/perceived above.

[bernardk]

Yes this one i agree, get out of the way. But how many times can you get out of the way? I have none of the above mentioned pride and ego you mentioned and I always get out of the way. But sometimes things happen.

 

Things happen then you must think WAT ACTUALLY HAPPENED.... is there anyway to prevent it. If you are not traveling at the correct speed of cos ppl will cut you when you are not in the correct lane. Yes i do agree that 2B have no throttle response. But that is where you learn. With no power where do you go? Safe guard yourself loh...

 

See some uncle ride also ok. Cos they simply dun care how fast the other lane car goes. he just keep in his middle or 2nd lane from left. We all do that too. If you still not comfortable then dun use expressway.

[xXxRatedxXx]

Hahha you guys ah... raping him alive!!

[dotless]

haha ok bro. well, is there any way to make the 4-stroke 2B bikes faster? well u can do it like what Kaylan said but other than that, i think u have to take up your complaint with the manufacturers. no choice la. 2b bikes can only go that fast. how fast do u want it to go. braking power also not there. go too fast and cannot stop in time also no use.

[xXxRatedxXx]

Nowadays the new 4 stroke 2b bikes in the market have better fuel consumption but cruising speed, top speed, pick-up are affected. I feel buyers should think twice when they buy these bikes.

 

Example: R15 top speed 140, cruising speed, around 90-100. Pulsar 180, top speed 115-120, cruising speed 80 as revealed by a member selling his 2nd hand bike in the garage sales section. Pulsar 200, only slightly higher top speed at 125 with cruising speed barely reaching 100. These facts have been confirmed with official specs of the bikes and people.

 

Pick-up wise, I won't comment much because bike manufacturers smart enough to think of several alternatives to compensate the loss of power of a 4 stroke as compared to 2 stroke although some 4 stroke 2b bikes pick up are still not good. (This explains why some parts are multiplied by 2 or by 4)

 

I just feel that such bikes are unsuitable for long expressways rides where a minimum of 100 km/h is needed and recommended 110km/h for "situations". These are just my own figures from observing which my friends also agree.

 

Yeah true, expressway speed limit generally 90km/h, some 80km/h (don't quote Nicoll Highway to me) but in reality, cars will frequently go more than that, at around 100km/h agree? Consider a Saturday or Sunday evening/night. You have to agree that people don't follow the normal road limit of 50km/h right? The same applies to expressway. If possible (no jams), cars will go above the expressway limit of 90. Agree?

 

Now, imagine if you are traveling at 80km/h cruising speed with your Pulsar at middle lane, high chance, you will encounter cars tailgating you, flashing headlights and cutting your lane abruptly to show their anger. Not just one car, but a series of car will continue to share lanes with your bike even though your bike is in the centre of the lane while overtaking to share their anger. If you move to the side of the lane while travelling at 80-90 to let the car overtake you easily or share lane with you, you are putting yourself in risk (defensive riding) These big cars owners are the worst. They will do many nasty thing like trying to grind you.

 

Maybe I am the only one seeing this happen to fellow motorcyclist or encountering it but I do personally know car drivers who purposely tailgate slower vehicles in front to pressure them to go faster or get out of the lane. My cousin is one of them, whom I don't agree with him.

 

But at the speed of 80-90, the expressway left lane is not a good lane for motorcycles for obvious reasons (laden with trucks). Of course, the motorcyclist may choose to linger at the lane marker between 2 lanes indefinitely but puts himself at risk if he do so for a very long time and at specific spots (fork at end of AYE, left goes to ECP/Tanjong Pagar, right goes to CTE).

 

Some will say whats the big deal? Just open throttle to 110km/h with your new 2b 4 stroke bike and keep up with the traffic. Very soon, you will have a heap load of problems with your stressed bike (pulsar especially).

 

Some will say I have never encountered or see this before? Thus, I ask you to ride your bike at 80 or 90 at middle lane at AYE or ECP and see if you have bad car drivers tailgating you or abruptly lane cutting you or grinding you.Similar situation here is when the normal road speed limit is 50 or 60 and when you follow the speed limit, you will find many big and heavily modded cars doing the same to you in anger. Try riding at 60 at normal roads, you will find heavily modded Integras, Civics and Lancers doing something funny to you.

 

 

Just my newbie humble opinion

 

There you summary in bold. perhaps TS had a particularly nasty incident that provoked him to air his view.

[Pluvius]

Things happen then you must think WAT ACTUALLY HAPPENED.... is there anyway to prevent it. If you are not traveling at the correct speed of cos ppl will cut you when you are not in the correct lane. Yes i do agree that 2B have no throttle response. But that is where you learn. With no power where do you go? Safe guard yourself loh...

 

See some uncle ride also ok. Cos they simply dun care how fast the other lane car goes. he just keep in his middle or 2nd lane from left. We all do that too. If you still not comfortable then dun use expressway.

 

I think maybe you didn't read(missed out) or misinterpret. The situation posed, is that we are traveling at the correct speed at the correct lane but majority of Singaporeans don't travel at the correct speed, they exceed it in even in the middle lane. And they will abruptly cut, grind, tailgate, horn, flash lights at you even if you are doing things right because they are irritated you block their way. (Big luxury cars, modded Lancers etc)

 

Which is why some uncles (youngsters) kena accident or they rely heavily on the mercy of other motorists for their safety but sooner or later, they will get into an accident. The probability will catch up eventually.

 

Don't use expressway is not a solution if one wants to travel from west to changi airport.

 

Thanks for your input

[bernardk]

I think people are already misunderstanding what I am saying and accusing me of suggesting things that I did not. I am not some sort of speed addict with a 2b bike as accused/perceived above.

 

If ppl wanna disturb you on road, it doesnt matters if you are 2B or 2A or 2 or 2*racer bike you are owning. No need to say car will disturb you cos biker sometime will also disturb bikers. So to me yes ppl will disturb you but if they knw you are not a potential ticker that will explode and ride faster, they will try other target cos they will find it boring...

 

So dun worry if you are slow. Slow but alert and safe, ppl wont complaint if in the correct lane, ppl also wont wanna bang you. Cos if they bang you they have to pay you. Unless they are so fast that they can kill you.

 

But if you are fast but blurr, then you knw the answer next. Bike has never been safe. No matter 2 stroke 4 stroke or anyhow stroke its still the same. Even if you traveling 2++kph, car can STILL tailgate you or worst overtake you.

 

Ride at your comfortable speed dun worry ppl tailgate. Just ride safe. If you are already in the middle lane then stay lor. I believe that 2B bike can easily keep up at 70-80 on eway rite. So if you are saying that you still find slow then those lorry and pick up with full load or SAF car traveling at 50kph then how they survive on road?

[Stoned]

I'm a supporter of bikes having more power as well. However, you have to consider that only what is produced can be sold. If it's not produced, they can't be made available by local shops.

 

What you're asking the local shops to bring in, or implying that should be brought in to our "local market", doesn't even exist on the international market to begin with. Whatever is available internationally has already been brought in from everywhere imaginable; Thailand, Europe, you name it.

 

Furthermore, 2b bikes in general are transport bikes and should play to their strengths of low FC and running costs. People seeking power and torque would logically just go for a larger capacity motorcycle.

 

Why squeeze an extra few ponies out of a miniscule engine when you can easily get those ponies from a larger engine?

 

Essentially, what you're asking for is illogical to produce.

[bernardk]

I think maybe you didn't read(missed out) or misinterpret. The situation posed, is that we are traveling at the correct speed at the correct lane but majority of Singaporeans don't travel at the correct speed, they exceed it in even in the middle lane. And they will abruptly cut, grind, tailgate, horn, flash lights at you even if you are doing things right because they are irritated you block their way. (Big luxury cars, modded Lancers etc)

 

Which is why some uncles (youngsters) kena accident or they rely heavily on the mercy of other motorists for their safety but sooner or later, they will get into an accident. The probability will catch up eventually.

 

Don't use expressway is not a solution if one wants to travel from west to changi airport.

 

Thanks for your input

 

Can you elaborate on the highlighted sentence? Wat do you mean by doing everything rite? And at wat speed? EWay i believe most of it have at least 4 lanes. which lane were you at???