Sheltered motoring in Singapore

[paiseh]

The number of cars on the road is determined by the number of coes given out and not the price.

[WanFazer]

Wow !!! Who doesn't know that.. Lmao !!!

[DeusExMachina]

The number of cars on the road is determined by the number of coes given out and not the price.

 

ORLY?

 

Thanks for the info....

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v305/Taco2575/captain_obvious.jpg

[paiseh]

no la, coz many ppl got the mis conception that last time low COE price den got many cars on the rd. they tend to link COE price with the number of cars put on the road.

[WanFazer]

no la, coz many ppl got the mis conception that last time low COE price den got many cars on the rd. they tend to link COE price with the number of cars put on the road.

 

Oh ic.. So dat time y is e COE low n now it have increased drastically ?

[DeusExMachina]

no la, coz many ppl got the mis conception that last time low COE price den got many cars on the rd. they tend to link COE price with the number of cars put on the road.

 

The 0% DP is a major factor of the increase in the number of cars simply because any Tom, D1ck and Harry can now buy a car without any cash on hand. He just throws everything into the installment plan (usually 10 years, and he dies c0ck stand).

 

So what happens? The sales ppl got many more orders and have to bid more aggressively to win their customers the COE. Read the adverts... "Guaranteed COE". How do you guarantee someone a COE? You bid aggressively.

 

If you set the min DP back to 30% in cash, you'll see the number of COE bids reduce drastically. And the COE prices will drop.

[CSV]

The 0% DP is a major factor of the increase in the number of cars simply because any Tom, D1ck and Harry can now buy a car without any cash on hand. He just throws everything into the installment plan (usually 10 years, and he dies c0ck stand).

 

So what happens? The sales ppl got many more orders and have to bid more aggressively to win their customers the COE. Read the adverts... "Guaranteed COE". How do you guarantee someone a COE? You bid aggressively.

 

If you set the min DP back to 30% in cash, you'll see the number of COE bids reduce drastically. And the COE prices will drop.

 

good idea to have min dp. i find the no DP idea absolutely ridiculous. if you have to take even 80 percent loan for a car, you CANNOT afford it. just imagine what happens in a medical emergency? all your monthly repayments will be gone.

 

alot of yuppies also like to go for cars when they don't have the means to. in any case, i'm all for a mandate to have mininum 10% dp. reduce the amount of traffic on the roads as well.

[paiseh]

i actually support the ERP idea to reduce traffic on the road. But cost of owning a car is too high, making saving on ERP seems not useful.

 

anyway, no one seems to be interested in the sheltered motoring in Singapore. i guess it will be at least another 10 years b4 we see the massive changes at marina area:

 

PSA shift to west coast, land reclaim, removal of ben shears bridge etc. in fact i am looking forward to the development on the land which had the railway tracks sitting on. hopefully some residential development for BTO.

[WanFazer]

The 0% DP is a major factor of the increase in the number of cars simply because any Tom, D1ck and Harry can now buy a car without any cash on hand. He just throws everything into the installment plan (usually 10 years, and he dies c0ck stand).

 

So what happens? The sales ppl got many more orders and have to bid more aggressively to win their customers the COE. Read the adverts... "Guaranteed COE". How do you guarantee someone a COE? You bid aggressively.

 

If you set the min DP back to 30% in cash, you'll see the number of COE bids reduce drastically. And the COE prices will drop.

 

Well said bro .. But COE price wnt drop drastically coz i believe its "controlled".. Got 1 time COE price suddenly dropped to $50/=, y ? Coz somebody purchased a large fleet of blue lanterns...

[WanFazer]

good idea to have min dp. i find the no DP idea absolutely ridiculous. if you have to take even 80 percent loan for a car, you CANNOT afford it. just imagine what happens in a medical emergency? all your monthly repayments will be gone.

 

alot of yuppies also like to go for cars when they don't have the means to. in any case, i'm all for a mandate to have mininum 10% dp. reduce the amount of traffic on the roads as well.

 

10% not enuf, 30% is e best n max 7 yrs loan..

[DeusExMachina]

i actually support the ERP idea to reduce traffic on the road. But cost of owning a car is too high, making saving on ERP seems not useful.

 

anyway, no one seems to be interested in the sheltered motoring in Singapore. i guess it will be at least another 10 years b4 we see the massive changes at marina area:

 

PSA shift to west coast, land reclaim, removal of ben shears bridge etc. in fact i am looking forward to the development on the land which had the railway tracks sitting on. hopefully some residential development for BTO.

 

 

I am for sheltered riding.

 

I like to ride under the Keppel bridge.

[paiseh]

If its raining heavily enough, there are certain sections of area with accumulated water pouring down. Just be aware of that.

 

Most likely some drainage problem on top

[WanFazer]

Im for sheltered riding but not tunnel, y cnt they make it like chonburi highway

[Pplater]

The minimum downpayment idea is theoritically sound, but not practical to implement. There is already a minimum downpayment in force at the moment, if I'm not wrong is 10%. But what happens is second hand car dealers who want to sell you the car at say, $20k, will declare to the bank that the car is sold to you at $22k. The dealer then tells you the extra $2k he puts on paper "dissapears" and gives u a cheeky smile before explaining the 10% downpayment rule. You still take a 20k loan on the car, but you pay nothing upfront.

 

A minumum downpayment rule was meant to deter people who are not financially secure from taking a car out at no initial cost. It was never meant to deter people from getting on the road or to reduce car population. In any case, i think it kinda failed big time

[DeusExMachina]

The minimum downpayment idea is theoritically sound, but not practical to implement. There is already a minimum downpayment in force at the moment, if I'm not wrong is 10%. But what happens is second hand car dealers who want to sell you the car at say, $20k, will declare to the bank that the car is sold to you at $22k. The dealer then tells you the extra $2k he puts on paper "dissapears" and gives u a cheeky smile before explaining the 10% downpayment rule. You still take a 20k loan on the car, but you pay nothing upfront.

 

A minumum downpayment rule was meant to deter people who are not financially secure from taking a car out at no initial cost. It was never meant to deter people from getting on the road or to reduce car population. In any case, i think it kinda failed big time

 

MAS can always enforce a law to allow banks to loan only up to say 70% of a car's value. That, coupled with regulations and stiff penalties for dealerships who flout this law by doctoring the payment documents can already produce results.

 

Since they allowed full loan, how many more COE applications have been made?

 

You see, ultimately, this is NOT about COE numbers or car population. That one is controlled. Every month, cars get scrapped, and they derive the supply of new COEs from there. Car financing policies do not affect that.

 

This is about the runaway COE prices. When you don't have to put a downpayment, you expose the market to many more ppl (most of whom who can't actually safely afford a car). Once you enforce legislation on the finance industry to prohibit full loans, you automatically disqualify those extra ppl from even attempting to buy a car or bid for COE.

 

The net effect is, less ppl bidding for COE. Less demand, prices go down.

 

 

 

You don't need ridiculously high COE prices.

You don't need ridiculously high ARF and taxes.

 

All you need to do is to force ppl to be able to pay say... 30% upfront for the car, and you'll see the demand drop like a farrking rock. The higher you shift the DP requirements, the lower the demand.

 

Over time, you can slowly cut COE supply.

Edited March 6, 2012 by DeusExMachina

[Pplater]

The idea is sound and logical. The enforecement is still tough. Its too easy to declare 30% more. 20k cheap 5 year old car can easily declare 26k. The difference is negligible. Too easy to walk away without downpayment. I doubt its feasible. Its just like claiming people die when they langar u and say this spoil that spoil hand pain leg pain. Too easy for couple thousand dollars discrepency to be exposed, and too many people doing it.

 

Until a regulation of car loans by a foolproof method is feasible, its just not being practiced. But I do agree that higher downpayments will lead to lesser people taking loans they cannot afford, and reducing pressures on COE bidding, which may lead to lesser vehicles on the road.

[paiseh]

minimum downpayment hard to enforce on used car but may be effective if implemented again on new cars since listed price is fixed.

[WanFazer]

Aiyah, at e end of e day its up to individual to think whether can afford or not... If cant afford n still want to buy then if kena financial prob then their psl lor.. I can only clap hand n lmao to see tis kind of pple get into trouble..

[Pplater]

minimum downpayment hard to enforce on used car but may be effective if implemented again on new cars since listed price is fixed.

 

Ah.. this I agree. But those who buy first hand cars at 60k to 100k are not price sensitive car buyers. They are less likely to be deterred by 10% or 30% downpayment. Only first time buyers have to fork out cash, as second time buyers who trade in need not worry about downpayment. Higher downpayments are more effective in deterring second hand car buyers who are more price sensitive, but the second hand car prices fluctuate frequently in response to COE prices and supply and demand. That also makes it harder to regulate and to determine real prices as prices are fluid.

 

I honestly hope I am wrong and some regulatory measure comes in force which is foolproof. I am all for higher downpayments, but I do not think it will work at present.

[WanFazer]

Gahmen dun spend millions of dollars in building n upgrading e ERP gantry for nothing n nd to cover back e costs/maintanence so for e number of cars on e road to decrease, it wnt happen.. But it will b controlled though, just IMHO

Edited March 6, 2012 by WanFazer

[CSV]

MAS can always enforce a law to allow banks to loan only up to say 70% of a car's value. That, coupled with regulations and stiff penalties for dealerships who flout this law by doctoring the payment documents can already produce results.

 

Since they allowed full loan, how many more COE applications have been made?

 

You see, ultimately, this is NOT about COE numbers or car population. That one is controlled. Every month, cars get scrapped, and they derive the supply of new COEs from there. Car financing policies do not affect that.

 

This is about the runaway COE prices. When you don't have to put a downpayment, you expose the market to many more ppl (most of whom who can't actually safely afford a car). Once you enforce legislation on the finance industry to prohibit full loans, you automatically disqualify those extra ppl from even attempting to buy a car or bid for COE.

 

The net effect is, less ppl bidding for COE. Less demand, prices go down.

 

 

 

You don't need ridiculously high COE prices.

You don't need ridiculously high ARF and taxes.

 

All you need to do is to force ppl to be able to pay say... 30% upfront for the car, and you'll see the demand drop like a farrking rock. The higher you shift the DP requirements, the lower the demand.

 

Over time, you can slowly cut COE supply.

 

well said. if you're running for legislation, my vote is yours.

[DeusExMachina]

Ah.. this I agree. But those who buy first hand cars at 60k to 100k are not price sensitive car buyers. They are less likely to be deterred by 10% or 30% downpayment. Only first time buyers have to fork out cash, as second time buyers who trade in need not worry about downpayment. Higher downpayments are more effective in deterring second hand car buyers who are more price sensitive, but the second hand car prices fluctuate frequently in response to COE prices and supply and demand. That also makes it harder to regulate and to determine real prices as prices are fluid.

 

I honestly hope I am wrong and some regulatory measure comes in force which is foolproof. I am all for higher downpayments, but I do not think it will work at present.

 

Rich ppl are not price insensitive. Otherwise you won't find the Mercedes driver who comes down to a school selling used textbooks cheap cheap. They save where they can, and a lower COE means that they can go for that extra vacation.

 

It's really a very simple equation. How many COEs vs How many bidders.

If the number of COEs is a constant, then the lower the number of bidders, the lower the bid amount.

 

Used cars are also factored into the COE supply. As long as a car, used or otherwise, is not scrapped, that's one less new COE available on the market. But again, we're not talking about the number of cars on the road now are we? We're talking about COE prices. Used cars already have their COEs paid.

[DeusExMachina]

well said. if you're running for legislation, my vote is yours.

 

So many ppl have already suggested a min DP policy.

[WanFazer]

Rich ppl are not price insensitive. Otherwise you won't find the Mercedes driver who comes down to a school selling used textbooks cheap cheap. They save where they can, and a lower COE means that they can go for that extra vacation.

 

It's really a very simple equation. How many COEs vs How many bidders.

If the number of COEs is a constant, then the lower the number of bidders, the lower the bid amount.

 

Used cars are also factored into the COE supply. As long as a car, used or otherwise, is not scrapped, that's one less new COE available on the market. But again, we're not talking about the number of cars on the road now are we? We're talking about COE prices. Used cars already have their COEs paid.

 

Haha true true true.. E richer they r, e more stingy they becomes... Puuuuiiiii !!!!

 

IMO, COE prices r controlled by ..... U know i know lah... When e price of new cars were so "affordable", some of e resale car company have say goodbye coz very low demand for used cars... Now that e price of new cars r soaring high, e used car section r back into business.. Wateva it is, e top pple gonna play around with their chess until game over then they switch to play snake n ladder hehe..

[PaLmEr]

the Marina Bay Expressway is 5km long and costs about S$5 Billion. That's a cool S$1 million per metre run of expressway.