Investment Talk

[xb84]

Originally posted by ermintham@February 10, 2007 05:33 pm

oh...then u all self read? or go thru some courseS?

maybe u shld transfer to SMU and do financial instruments and instutional markets module.

 

btw all these investment related stuff are all over the internet, just google, only when u want to learn more in depth the courses benefit.

 

my view.

[ermintham]

k thanks for the heads up

[E.V.ilyn]

in one of the older threads there was mention about buying tbills directly from bank. well, i finally had the time to do it.

 

it wasn't as bad as made out to be. just fill in 1 or 2 forms, give photocopy of ic, and that's it. there wasn't any queue either. in fact i didn't really have to queue even though i went during lunch hour. you do not have to go to the service counters. just get a number for the invest shop.

 

so how is it like compared to buying from poems? well, first of all the return is higher. based on my calculation, i got 3.1%. according to poems, they are selling at 2.9%. so that's a 0.2% difference. this difference is the commission that poems charges. this translates to $2 per $1k you purchase.

 

you can try this if you have say $50k. dump $30k into buying tbills from the bank. then with the remainder $20k, split into 10 $2k portions. every week buy tbills through poems with each share that you have prepared.

 

so what does this give you? $30k invested via bank, a little more troublesome but this is done once every 3mths, giving you not much, ~$60 more compared to buying all through poems. then buying through poems is easier since it's a 5min online/telephone job, best for high frequency buys.

 

so long as for the first 3mths you can survive, thereafter you'll have a sum of money coming back every week giving you higher returns compared to fixed-d and also better flexibility.

 

timeline is something like:

week 1: invest $30k via bank

week 2: invest $2k via poems

week 3: invest $2k via poems

week 4: invest $2k via poems

week 5: invest $2k via poems

week 6: invest $2k via poems

week 7: invest $2k via poems

week 8: invest $2k via poems

week 9: invest $2k via poems

week 10: invest $2k via poems

week 11: invest $2k via poems

week 12: invest $1k via poems (maybe you need to top up a little to buy $1k, since at this point of time you have probably invested ~$49.6k or so for a $50k value)

week 13: $30k matures

week 14: $2k matures

week 15: $2k matures

...

 

maybe a bit pointless since you can also choose to sell tbills anytime but you may not get back your initial investment. by employing a strategy like this you are more or less assured that you will have ready funds when you need them and less likely to lose money. depending on your needs, lifestyle, funds available, etc., you can play around with the investment amounts and the intervals. you may have $5k in your savings/current account as emergency funds, then maybe you can schedule your tbills purchases every 2-4weeks.

[Throttle]

Wah so troublesome.

Time is money indeed.

anyway my fixed monthly SGD deposit which pays me 3.22%pa

[E.V.ilyn]

Originally posted by Throttle@February 15, 2007 05:37 pm

Wah so troublesome.

Time is money indeed.

anyway my fixed monthly SGD deposit which pays me 3.22%pa

hahaha... yes definitely rather troublesome but may be suitable for some peeps. the less troublesome way is just to buy tbills straight from the bank and don't bother about creating close intervals cash inflows.

 

time is money but if you've time but no money then you can use time to convert to money. self improve, speculate, invest, maximise, work ot, etc.

 

i believe many of us wish we have enough cash flow to open a fixed-d account that puts us in the same interest bracket as you but alas...

[Throttle]

Originally posted by E.V.ilyn@February 16, 2007 02:59 am

time is money but if you've time but no money then you can use time to convert to money. self improve, speculate, invest, maximise, work ot, etc.

Well Said!

[hydrop]

I would like to have more info on S$ Time/Fixed Deposit. Which bank provides the best rates and how does it work? Thanks!

 

[Throttle]

Go call up all the banks and ask for their rate lah..

what do you mean "how does it work?"

 

if the sum is substantial, then you got more say. if only $50k then just accept whatever is given. in other words "LL" haha

 

cheers HCNY

[hydrop]

Originally posted by Throttle@February 18, 2007 11:25 am

Go call up all the banks and ask for their rate lah..

what do you mean "how does it work?"

 

if the sum is substantial, then you got more say. if only $50k then just accept whatever is given. in other words "LL" haha

 

cheers HCNY

Happy CNY to u too! Just wondering why banks don't publish their rates online like for those savings accounts?

[Throttle]

savings rates changes as and when on a daily basis and the rate is quite insignificant in general so Banks not bothered. The bank in general doesnt care about the money in the savings accounts, so the rate sucks

[E.V.ilyn]

Originally posted by hydrop@February 18, 2007 10:31 am

I would like to have more info on S$ Time/Fixed Deposit. Which bank provides the best rates and how does it work? Thanks!

 

different banks have different rates for different amounts for different lengths during different period. the only way to know is to either call them up or to walk in and ask. they occasionally have "promotional" rates for various amounts, but the "more attractive" rates usually is 2 years or more worth of the middle income individual. the last time i heard uob offers like 2.4% pa for min 30k during one of their promotion. scb at a point of time offered similar rate but for 50k.

 

working is simple. put in say $50k for say 2yrs and they promise you say 1.5% pa. if you withdraw any amount during the tenure period i.e. before the fixed-d matures, you do not get any interest.

 

as mentioned earlier in this thread, unless you have substantial amount of money such that the bank will give you a interest rate over 3% pa, it's still better to invest in tbills imo. tbills over the last year at least have consistently returned ~3.1% +- 0.5% pa (annualised). you can get this rate from as little as 1k, and you only get locked in for 3 months.

 

check out the faqs in sgs, poems, etc. if you're interested.

[E.V.ilyn]

heard one of my ex-colleague got 40% returns from diying through poems, mostly unit trust. and that is quite a good fraction of his annual salary package. think he can fulfill his million retirement dream. *envious*

 

that said, i've read that due to the power of compounding it is always better to start investing in ut as early as possible but i could not quite catch it. does ut work like shares where you get dividends? if not, no matter how early you start, your returns is still based on the price of that ut at point of selling. and the profit is only the price of buy - price is sale multiplied by the quantity. no compounding element that way i see?

[Throttle]

power of compounding only works if there are returns reinvested to be compounded over the years. and to buy early to enjoy power of compounding means this thing is a sure winner. (tell me which UT is a sure winner and I show you a law suit, haha)

 

for unit trust, it may not be better to start investing earlier due to power of compounding simply becos unit trust returns are not guaranteed.

The power of compounding as a reason to start investing earlier rightfully cannot be used here. it is probably just a sales pitch.

[E.V.ilyn]

Originally posted by Throttle@February 19, 2007 12:01 am

power of compounding only works if there are returns reinvested to be compounded over the years. and to buy early to enjoy power of compounding means this thing is a sure winner. (tell me which UT is a sure winner and I show you a law suit, haha)

 

for unit trust, it may not be better to start investing earlier due to power of compounding simply becos unit trust returns are not guaranteed.

The power of compounding as a reason to start investing earlier rightfully cannot be used here. it is probably just a sales pitch.

what do you mean by returns in unit trust context?

 

does unit trust work by the way of now the price is $1, you buy 1000, assume no charges, you have 1000 units. 10yrs later, the price is $2, you thus sell the 1000 units you own for $2000. thus returns = $1000. or along the way the number of units you own will increase even if you do no invest more? or does unit trust deal out some form of dividend?

 

noob

[Throttle]

unit trust, mutuals funds mostly work on a nav or net asset value basis.

You can find the explanation of NAV on most financial websites.

 

Anyway, your units will not increase unless you buy more

some reinvest dividends into the fund itself, others payout to subscribers. depends on their mandate.

 

If you subscribe into an equity fund for $1 a unit and the market crashes bringing it down to 80c a unit, you have simply lost 20%.

If the dividends are reinvested, it will also be reflected in the NAV of the fund.

 

Unit Trusts are the layman's Mutual Funds. Both basically work the same way. but Unit trust commission and mgt fee could be a lot higher due to lack of economies of scale for the single retail investor.

[E.V.ilyn]

Originally posted by Throttle@February 19, 2007 11:51 am

unit trust, mutuals funds mostly work on a nav or net asset value basis.

You can find the explanation of NAV on most financial websites.

 

Anyway, your units will not increase unless you buy more

some reinvest dividends into the fund itself, others payout to subscribers. depends on their mandate.

 

If you subscribe into an equity fund for $1 a unit and the market crashes bringing it down to 80c a unit, you have simply lost 20%.

If the dividends are reinvested, it will also be reflected in the NAV of the fund.

 

Unit Trusts are the layman's Mutual Funds. Both basically work the same way. but Unit trust commission and mgt fee could be a lot higher due to lack of economies of scale for the single retail investor.

i see. so am i right to say that there are certain unit trust that deals out dividends in cash to the investor and yet others that gives out bonus units?

[Throttle]

Yeah , that is possible.

 

However, most sought after top end funds will not give out bonus units.

the increase in NAV if attained is what investors seek anyway..

[danieltanboonhuat]

Originally posted by E.V.ilyn@January 24, 2007 04:17 pm

Anyone have any views on the SRS (Supplementary Retirement Scheme)?

 

It seems quite useful if you're paying income tax and rather than pay income tax, put money into SRS such that you don't have to pay or pay lesser income tax. Then when you retire, draw money from this account like you paymaster. Depending on how much you draw, you either defer income tax till then or pay no taxes at all. You can also buy SGS bonds and t-bills with this account.

that is good if you are currently being taxed on income tax and have disposable income on your hands,,, probably applicale for income above 40K a year only..

 

 

basically you set aside money in the SRs scheme, buy whetever you wan and it will be exempt from being included in your income tax assessment( just like CPG contribution),

 

The differnece from CPF, you can chose to withdraw it in an emergency, (subjest to a small surcharge and the amount withdrawn being included in your income tax assessment for that year

 

so that means,,, you can save now, get charges less for income tax,..

 

 

later on in life maybe when you retire or maybe no income for a year (pregnant, sabbath, tour etc etc) , you can withdraw the money,,,, as your own income is down for that year, you won;t hit the assessable range.,.

 

hope it;s readable

[danieltanboonhuat]

Originally posted by E.V.ilyn@January 24, 2007 04:19 pm

How about CPF investments? What allows you to invest using CPF monies? The 2.5%/4% interest is not really interesting.

30 percent of your ordinary account is allowed to trade stocks,,,

 

100 percent for other apprived instruments like unit trrust, insurance etc etc...

 

10% max for Gold,,,

 

options, futures are not allowed

[danieltanboonhuat]

Originally posted by E.V.ilyn@December 04, 2006 05:00 pm

My mum just showed me a "lobang". Apparently someone just introduced her to this thingy called SwissCash and she bought it!!! Wanted to get me to buy. Then when I showed disinterest she wanted to buy using my IC... #%@^#&

 

I later ran a quick check but found it rather dubious. MLM style. No information on how the money is spent, etc. Their FAQ says that since you are getting fixed payout every month, you do not need to know how they use your money for investment...

 

Imagine they are promising 300% returns over 18 months! Guaranteed! If this is true (which is too good to be true and in my dictionary, means most likely untrue) then I might as well save 2 years worth of salary, dump 1 year's into the SwissCash, then live on the remaining year for 18 months, then when 18 months is up, I'll have 300% back in return! This means I'm I do not need to work at all!!! All I ever need to do is to rechannel the returns into the investment.

 

Just hope she don't buy anymore into it... I'm doubtful if she can even get any amount back...

be careful,.,,

 

I am doubtful over this swiss cash thingy,

 

by the way. on the moneysense websitem it's blacklisted under dubious companys by the govt

 

it;s not regulated in SG

[danieltanboonhuat]

Originally posted by stevenminqijia@February 11, 2007 04:12 pm

if u really have tt much. will u waste ur time here talking rubbish? if u can ear a few million then cont go earn maybe billion. dun waste time here takking with us poor ppl

hmm,,.,,

 

 

so angry for ??

 

bikers must be poor meh?

 

you are sadly mistaken

[marvypower]

it all depends on individual la..

there're quite a number of poor fellows like me..

we're not used to throwing 50-100k here and there readily..

I only throw 500-1000 ard to pay for insurance, road taxes, broker fees, credit card bills...

[danieltanboonhuat]

hmm... it;s really how you manage your money ba.

 

 

i started with only 100 a month,. that was two years back.

 

now 5 lots in SPC all in. show hand

[wolfang]

Originally posted by danieltanboonhuat@February 21, 2007 12:48 am

hmm... it;s really how you manage your money ba.

 

 

i started with only 100 a month,. that was two years back.

 

now 5 lots in SPC all in. show hand

u got 5 lots in SPC?

 

Although i am not a pro, i do think SPC will fall hard right after dividend is pay out.

 

Better SELL SPC and see the situation. Now 4.62 but before dividend is announced, it was about 4.12.. DANGER!

 

Get involved in other credible shares (but not much fluctuations) like new share CItySpring...

[danieltanboonhuat]

I am already out keke

 

 

Cityspring?

 

not in my radar at the moment

 

I am one of those who believes a major correction is coming.

 

 

let;s wait and see