Revision of Class 2 license system

[mechwira]

like i said, i agree 2 strokers are on their way out. in fact, just today i spotted the new yamaha ybr125; i'm not sure but i suspect its the 4 stroke replacement for the rxz. but to force an immediate phase-out right now? i strongly believe we need a few years yet for such a thing to be acceptable. just imagine, no more rxz and nsr150 and krr150 and tzm 150 available as new. backlash from riders and manufacturers alike. riders riding these bikes today only allowed to keep them till expiry of COE. think of the 'uncles' choosing the rxz for financial reasons, planning to keep the bikes for perhaps 20 years; after all, there are rxk older than that around today. and these uncles on 9 year old rxz suddenly forced to get new bike in 1 year's time, and cant even sell their bike.

 

when EU emissions legislations were raised a year ago, the old fazer6 suddenly found itself unable to qualify for export into europe. but the european market is so powerful that yamaha jumped up and produced a brand new fazer6. we dont hold such power, and we have no choice but to allow a 'natural death' for our SEA 2 strokers. its dying, but not yet dead.

 

i am very open to ideas on avoiding this catastrophe, and to use environemntal issues. unfortunately i do not see how we can argue for the environment without suggesting phasing out 2 strokers immediately. sorry, i am not willing to put my name down for a proposal to phase out 2 strokers today.

 

and regarding my proposal, my original intention was to write in personally. i value the privacy of my written proposal, and thus i'd rather not post it for ppl to read. assuming it is given a listening ear, it will be posted at the feedback unit website anyway. i'm open to a petition, but i have no intention of taking the lead there; my intention remains as sending a private proposal. i'll be submitting monday 070604.

[rhema83]

If you are intending to submit a private proposal, we are in no position to stop you. However, do not expect any tangible support because we cannot put our names down on a proposal that we have never seen. I hope you understand.

 

However, if you are willing to discuss the writing of the proposal over the forum, we will be happy to lend you our helping hands.

 

Right now, I agree with your ideas but not your methodology.

[mechwira]

i've submitted the proposal as of this post. if it gets a listening ear, i'll update on this thread. if not, heck, no regrets, at least i've tried....

 

if anyone wants to continue pressing the issue in anyway whatsoever, feel free to take the baton from me. this topic doesn have to end here. its just that i've taken the lead as far as i'm willing to.

[mechwira]

Originally posted by rhema83@Jun 6 2004, 10:52 PM

If you are intending to submit a private proposal, we are in no position to stop you. However, do not expect any tangible support because we cannot put our names down on a proposal that we have never seen. I hope you understand.

 

However, if you are willing to discuss the writing of the proposal over the forum, we will be happy to lend you our helping hands.

 

Right now, I agree with your ideas but not your methodology.

didn you get my mail wif the proposal? the others did, and i confirmed with them that they've read and agreed to place their names down. i'm very sorry if theres a screw up somewhere and you didn receive, i sent it to everyone.

 

and yes, my intention has been a private proposal, and i fully understand if u disagree wif the method. its just that i'm not willing to go the distance in a huge concerted effort. if anyone else willing to do so, i'd support, depending on the issues raised.

[Arcfire]

Originally posted by wolfang@May 29 2004, 06:25 PM

i dont think age affects riding.

 

for myself, i think i can achieve a class2 before i reach 21.

 

im not saying i'm gd, i got friend also same as me, jus waiting to get class2 end of this yr.

 

its the riding attitude of the rider to determine safety aspects.

 

implementing age into riding, i don't think it is adequate.

 

Went to thailand, kids ride cupkias here and there, but i did not c any accident.

(maybe i did not c). their road traffic condition, oh man, cars cut here and there,

super dangerous. The kids can mange the bike and still ride..... Age doesnt play a part in riding, maybe abit but not all.... hehe

 

thanks for reading.

i disagree wif your point that age does not matter though.......if that is the case then why the age restriction on getting a license at all? how about letting your 10 yr old son ride an R1? No matter how much you say that age is not as important as maturity, it cannot be denied that there will always be a direct relation between age n maturity. There are always extremes where a 40 yr old is still trigger happy wif his fast bike but there is a reason why older pple are said to be wiser.......

[mechwira]

update on proposal:

 

it is currently being used to practice 'tai chi', ie, being pushed around. Feedback Unit forwarded it LTA, then SPF and MCDS, and finally one of them forwarded it to something called 'testing and licensing branch'. apparently it has finally reached a 'correct destination'. no replies as yet.

 

coincidentally, today's papers (either streats or today, cant remember which) has an article regarding the feedback unit. apparently the director or something complains that the agencies are fond of giving monosyllabic answers to feedback, or else feedback that is implemented understandably takes a long time causing contributors to feel that no reply was given. well anyway nothing to do except wait and see.

[hohosaint]

Please update on the outcome when a reply is made from the authority.

[mechwira]

i have received the following reply:

 

Dear gentlemen,

 

First allow me to thank you for your keen interest in road traffic

and safety issues. It is with such socially responsible members of public

like yourself that allow us to improve our service delivery further.

 

2 We have carefully studied your proposal and scrutinised the true

merits of your arguments. You have brought forth some very interesting

points which definitely warrant further consideration on our part. And as

you have rightly pointed out, the motorcycle market is indeed undergoing

rapid metamorphosis and therefore has presented us with an opportunity to

update our motorcycle licensing system.

 

3 While we will always strive to factor in greater convenience to the

motoring public, be it drivers or riders, in our testing and licensing

systems, convenience cannot and must not be our sole consideration. Road

safety and driver/rider competency are. The 3-tier motorcycle licensing

system was introduced in the early 80s to arrest the alarmingly high fatal

accident rates among young and inexperienced riders with high capacity

motorcycles. The aim was to make sure motorcyclists, especially the young

riders, have a reasonable amount of interval between licences to gain

accumulative skills and experience. This move had gained much success in

reducing the number of fatal motorcycle accidents.

 

4 While our fatal motorcycle accident rates have fallen steadily over

the past years, the situation is still far from ideal. As a responsible

and experienced motorcyclist yourself, I am sure you can understand the

importance of accumulating real-world riding skills and experience. And

therefore any move to introduce changes to the motorcycle licensing system

must be done with the core aim of enhancing skill competency and road

safety. It will of course be great if as a consequence we can bring

greater convenience and cost-savings to motorcyclists.

 

5 Having said that, both your suggestions showed promising merits

within and therefore will not go unnoticed. I cannot promise that your

suggestions will be adopted eventually, but you can be assured that your

proposal has been a good catalyst and will be included as part of our

considerations in our ongoing review of the licensing system. We will also

engage our foreign counterparts, road safety partners and the major

motorcycle industry players to see how we can bring our motorcycle

licensing system to closer relevance with the changing trends.

 

6 Thank you once again for taking the effort to write in, which is very

much appreciated.

 

 

With warmest regards,

 

(Received from the Research & Planning of the Traffic Police Department)

 

i suppose, all things considered, this is as good a reply as we can hope to get. its not an outright rejection, and at least they're willing to concede that there are changes in the motorcycle manufacturing industry that might possibly warrant a review. what that review eventually will be, or if there will be a review at all, is out of our hands.

 

thank you william, hohosaint and supernov@ for agreeing to place your names down. thank you to rhema too, although i donno what happened to the proposal i mailed.

[hohosaint]

You're welcome...

 

Our Nation must be progressing than backdating.

 

As for safety measures, nobody can compromise safety, only themselves and road users. It's all about road discipline and behaviour.

[william_liu]

Well done and thank you too to mechwira for taking time to draft and submit the proposal. You know what they say, one small step.... one giant leap....

[supernov]

i believe all the kudos should go to you mechwira...

[floppy]

Originally posted by Arcfire@Jun 7 2004, 04:52 PM

i disagree wif your point that age does not matter though.......if that is the case then why the age restriction on getting a license at all? how about letting your 10 yr old son ride an R1? No matter how much you say that age is not as important as maturity, it cannot be denied that there will always be a direct relation between age n maturity. There are always extremes where a 40 yr old is still trigger happy wif his fast bike but there is a reason why older pple are said to be wiser.......

Statistically proven that young riders, ie below the age of 30, have the highest percentage in accidents and fatalities (and I'm sure higher still if break down to under the age of 25).

While there are a fair number of safe young riders... there's more than a handful of reckless ones. Maturity is important, there's little yardstick to define it. Age is, perhaps, the easiest and quickest method to assume maturity.

[rhema83]

That is one of the most detailed and positive reply I've seen from the authorities, in my personal experience! Great work, mechwira!

[comics00]

very interesting & eye(ear) opening:smile:

 

i only hope that wat ever changes the authority does will help keep our new riders on the road & not sending them crashing off the road

[burningacid]

hmm... so theres no more updates from the authorities? except to wait and wait.....?

[Kira Yamato]

Originally posted by burningacid@Sep 3 2004, 05:39 PM

hmm... so theres no more updates from the authorities? except to wait and wait.....?

u r rite!!!!!!!

[-PeNsKe-]

:sian:

[mechwira]

doing spring cleaning on my comp, found out i actually still keeping the original proposal i wrote. gonna post it here then delete from my comp.

 

and no i dun have any further replies or updates. i doubt the authorities will keep me in the loop.

[icycloud]

are we president geroge? or are we geoge son?

are we bill gates or bills son?

or are u EX PM mr goh or his grnadson?

or r u mr lee xiang long son or wat?

The goverment wont care wat we says one lah.. all they intersted is taking money from us.

[mechwira]

Originally posted by icycloud@Sep 11 2004, 02:35 AM

are we president geroge? or are we geoge son?

are we bill gates or bills son?

or are u EX PM mr goh or his grnadson?

or r u mr lee xiang long son or wat?

The goverment wont care wat we says one lah.. all they intersted is taking money from us.

i donno wats ur problem but if i feel strongly about something and i (and others) have the balls to bring it up with my real name on it instead of hiding behind an anonymous nick, then its my business. u dont think it'll do any good nobody ask u take part.

[hohosaint]

Originally posted by mechwira@Sep 11 2004, 11:48 AM

i donno wats ur problem but if i feel strongly about something and i (and others) have the balls to bring it up with my real name on it instead of hiding behind an anonymous nick, then its my business. u dont think it'll do any good nobody ask u take part.

I think mech's correct by increasing Class 2A to a limit of 600cc isn't a bad idea in Economically and of course, the flaw of 2A. Let us look at the regional pictures than tiny little Leeapore. We claimed that we want to be Asia No.1, but our system still's lacked of something to be improved.

[dolfin]

Originally posted by icycloud@Sep 11 2004, 02:35 AM

are we president geroge? or are we geoge son?

are we bill gates or bills son?

or are u EX PM mr goh or his grnadson?

or r u mr lee xiang long son or wat?

The goverment wont care wat we says one lah.. all they intersted is taking money from us.

Why pour cold water when Mechwira is standing up for the good of the biking community? Irrespective of what the authority had replied, he deserves our support for the effort.

 

Mechwira ..... :thumb: and thanks.

[Scarab]

Originally posted by icycloud@Sep 11 2004, 02:35 AM

are we president geroge? or are we geoge son?

are we bill gates or bills son?

or are u EX PM mr goh or his grnadson?

or r u mr lee xiang long son or wat?

The goverment wont care wat we says one lah.. all they intersted is taking money from us.

If we don't try how do we know can or not. Just like if you never ride a bike, how would you know the joys of riding.

 

But of course if don't have the balls (figure of speech) to stand up fro what you believed in, then say w anything also useless.

 

Our bro here, whether or not anything comes out of it, at least he did something about it.

[mechwira]

Originally posted by Scarab+Sep 14 2004, 02.35AM-->

QUOTE (Scarab @ Sep 14 2004, 02.35AM)

Our bro here, whether or not anything comes out of it, at least he did something about it. [/b]   thanx

[BadgerBadgerBadger]

Hello Everyone,

 

I looked thru the posts and read that most of the items were about division of the classes, age, lack of bikes in the 2A class etc.

 

I was pondering over this issue before i chanced upon this post.here's my $0.02 worth...

 

1.Safety is of paramount concern when riding.

Nothing even comes close to it. If that is ingrained in the mindset of the riders, it shouldnt be an issue if the bike is large or small.

 

2.Bad habits can kill.I feel that bad habits form easier when you ride a smaller bike.For example, on a smaller bike, you can easily squeeze here and there just because you are able to. These habits are reinforced when you eventually get your large bike license.

 

2. Smaller bikes are exposed to more danger on national highways. Smaller bikes travel near their designed capacities on highways. If people want to drive a big car for safety reasons, we should allow greater access to larger bikes for the same reason.The least we can do is to encourage safer use of 2-wheelers..

 

3. Psychologically, the differences in the classes may create piston envy some. Newly qualified riders of smaller bikes may feel a need to be equal with the larger bike next to him and hence put himself in a situation whereby safety is compromised. Remove the classes,let every rider choose their own ride,you would have one emotion less to handle whilst riding.

 

4.Education. Learners should be educated to ride safely on large bikes from the beginning. Form the right habits from the beginning and it would not be so difficult to change later in life. Treat the root of the problem instead to attending to the symptions.Age restriction seems to be adopted by most first world countries, that could be used as a guideline.

 

If this offended anyone out there i'm ..

but if our people is our national resource, we should not let it be wasted on roads and highways.

 

Have a good day.