Let's bring down the price of COE together

[Tachnicolour]

In the olden days when a group of people (or a person) planned to make changes they had a gathering and quietly discussed the matters. Not we bring this up on the 'WHOLE WIDE WORLD" page and everyone can see. everyone?? yes??? who??/ who else. so how to bring price down?? surely they will counteract lah!!! correct or not??

Precisely. All "they" need to do is say "sorry ah, due to our forecast, blah blah, too many vehicles on the road, COE quota slash". Prices go back up.

[mechwira]

the only way to influence the COE price is from a large group of bidders putting in high bid prices. which was what a group of dealers recently did, got called up for investigation possibly getting fined for it, for those who read news.

 

small group of people or citizens putting high bids, no effect. large group of people or citizens, you rally them to all put low bids oso will have no effect. i have read several versions of the $1 bidding technique, none of which will work but ppl believe they work because they misunderstand the system just like what bruce71 said. and yes the system is dam simple to understand.

[Tyrian]

Allow me to explain how my $1 technique works

 

When buying new bikes, tell bike shop we only willing pay $1 for COE. Anything more than that we dont buy from bike shop.

 

Now, when everyone does that, shop have no business. When they have no business, they cannot survive (unless they can survive on 2nd hand bike sales alone).

 

So in order for the shop secure your business, coz everyone will not pay more than $1 for COE, bike shop will pay $2 for COE and charge u $1 for it.

 

Done deal.

 

now, the rich monkeys will pay $2, $3 and $4 for COE. this is how it will never work.

 

Back to my point, we need to change the mindset that paying high COE is dumb. Its just like buying a bottle of engine oil at $100 per bottle when it only cost $20 per bottle.

[Orleng]

Sounds good. Now, educate them all to also refuse to pay COV for HDB. At the same time, don't patronise shops which raise prices for non-essential items by 5c. people power eh?

 

Heh. As long as there are rich buggers out there willing to pay for the bike. Or people who decide to COI for long period (so as to diminish the visible effect of an increased COE, assuming a 2K coe with 7yr x 6%, that's only $10 more per mth as compared to if COE was $1, naturally, this is for bikes, not cars).

 

Or, people who switch from cars to bikes.

[Silent Hunter]

I really got go and compare prices one.

Ya, I know I cheapskate. Kiam Siap Gui.

But if prices go up by 10c I really will go somewhere else buy, or wait until got sale then buy.

[kzone]

sianz... need to renew coe this mth for my vespa

wish there is a weekend scheme for bikes!

[Tyrian]

Time to predict COE prices after new MAS regulation

 

Prediction: COE at $1500 to $1700 due to

 

1) longer waiting period from 2 to 3 weeks

 

 

[736cc]

Time to predict COE prices after new MAS regulation

 

Prediction: COE at $1500 to $1700 due to

 

1) longer waiting period from 2 to 3 weeks

 

 

[ATTACH=CONFIG]272652[/ATTACH]

 

Yea should be around this range

[kzone]

Another bike Coe expiring.. Maybe just renew 5 yrs for my phantom.

[Throttle]

I think, it is very reasonable for bike COE to be about $2000-3000 range

 

it's more important that COE prices remain steady, than swinging.

at least market can be stable and finances can be planned better.

 

dont waste time thinking of how to get COE prices down.

the nature of the scheme just doesnt allow it to happen.

even if it does,market forces will just drive it back up.

Look at property, cars, watches, branded goods, even yong tau foo at foodcourt.

 

Be ready to pay a certain sum of money for a certain level of material.

Singapore is no longer what it was in the 90s.

 

dont get me wrong, i'm not happy about it either, but just trying to wake you guys up to reality.

Edited May 19, 2013 by Throttle

[MR BIKER]

But throttle, isnt it weird that the market is like that. dont you think , it is being played by certain group of people who is capable of paying that amount of money. what happen if these people decide one day to bid 10k for a bike coe?? yah you are right, then many people will not buy bikes and bike shops will then sell leftover secondhand bikes or bikers wil just stop riding (which will be almost impossible )

its just TS and others are trying ways to find ways to help to bring the price down. just trying. most definitely can never go back to $1 but at least 1k?

[ben1112]

IMHO as long as COE remains 10-20% of total bike price is pretty reasonable. Not as though like car like that 50% or more.

[wait4me]

I think, it is very reasonable for bike COE to be about $2000-3000 range

 

it's more important that COE prices remain steady, than swinging.

at least market can be stable and finances can be planned better.

 

dont waste time thinking of how to get COE prices down.

the nature of the scheme just doesnt allow it to happen.

even if it does,market forces will just drive it back up.

Look at property, cars, watches, branded goods, even yong tau foo at foodcourt.

 

Be ready to pay a certain sum of money for a certain level of material.

Singapore is no longer what it was in the 90s.

 

dont get me wrong, i'm not happy about it either, but just trying to wake you guys up to reality.

 

bo pian , u ish elite wan hahahah

[Throttle]

bo pian , u ish elite wan hahahah

 

I am working class, no silver spoon, simi elite?

Boh at least $30mil, how to be elite in todays context?

[wait4me]

I am working class, no silver spoon, simi elite?

Boh at least $30mil, how to be elite in todays context?

 

u have 3m at least lo ..

 

your hobbies are my annual pay liao hehehehhe

[keyxblade]

I think coe price is okay for now. sometimes i see those very bad condition bike still on the road, if coe is very cheap they can just renew COE on the bad condition bikes, and it is quite dangerous on the road. I wonder how they pass bike inspection.

[guangwei]

Around 1 in 10 residents owns a car here at Singapore according to wiki. So say for instances if there are 500,000 cars in Singapore and each COE cost them 60k on a cheap calculation

The government would had collected 500,000*60,000=$30,000,000,000, worth of money selling papers.

 

 

So I was always wondering, where did the money we paid for the COE(This 30 billion) went to? What are they used for? Thats already about half of bill gate.

 

Also I dont understand how they can convince at least half of the population with this extremely obviously flawed system by rewarding whoever that pay them the most to use the Singapore road. Singapore belongs to all Singaporeans and everyone are entitled the rights of ownership. The government may had planned the building of the roads, but it is the people that finance the building of the road. Thats common sense, for being Singaporean the road are actually owned by you in another sense.

 

I say this flawed system is just an excuse to earn more money out of the people. Well sucks the previous generation are very supportive and obedience and doesn't really had a voice of their own since Lee(s) are like the supreme gods in their mind and let them decide on it, from what I noticed among mine relatives, they perceived people who are well english educated as better and more capable people alot more vigorously than people of mine generation. Government are well english educated, they are chinese/little educated. Hence they listen and follow whatever the government said without much questioning.

 

If there is a system where cert must be given to be eligible to use the road, I will simply use a simple queuing system where everybody should had noticed since at our primary school canteen.

When there is a canteen stall that sell extremely delicious chicken rice, what happen is the queue will just simply got really long everytime during recess because of the demand. Well, just simply spend more time queuing then, since theres a limit how much plate of chicken rice the auntie can serve at a time.

How this queuing system work is you will send an application form, and simply wait for the queue isn't that way more simple and fair?

Every month the government will just simply give out 5000 of this cert on first come first serve basis. The earlier you fill up the form, the earlier your waiting date is.

And by doing this the effect would be the same, the number of the cars are the same, for every 5000 additional new cars every month, 5000 additional old cars COE had expired.

 

Then again the government would lost their opportunity to make money. Since they does not ever gave a proper explanation to the people where did the money went to, why are people still on agreeable terms with the COE system thing, and what exactly cost 30billion? IMO it isn't even suppose to make us pay more than $10. The reason why I would pay $10 is for the quality of the paper and the ink.

Why and how exactly did the COE system start? What exactly are people in the past thinking? Just why are people arguing that COE should be cheaper, if you really want to protest, on an ethical approach, this COE are taking your money without a valid reason in the first place. The controlling car reason is just a mask, the core reason behind the COE system is obviously, government grand money making plan. Where the money went for good or bad? I'm just amazed people are still more engrossed to argue to lower the price more than finding the reason out. People in the past really think differently. Even mine father say the same thing too and he never ever wondered where the money went to, everyday hes just complaining with relatives that the price went up or goes down like you. lols

 

Then again it had become a tradition after so many years and its now unlikely to get revamped unless it got under some tremendous controversy by the big personal. But won't happen, its already part of Singapore. To me its a trademark of Singaporean willingness to give in their everything for their respected leaders, their hero who bought them out of poverty. its definitely nothing for the good of singapore well-being.

 

 

btw

this current existence system also reminds me of the some ridiculous medieval age game in wc3 like 8 years ago, where the warlord actually made the peasant pay tax in the amount of their own choice, then after he collected the tax, he will note down the peasant that paid him the least tax and execute him, the game continues until one peasant is left, and the player behind the last peasant is the winner. its ridiculous of course for the peasant but the governing system is there for the warlord's well-being. the game is a minigames map called urther party.

Edited May 23, 2013 by guangwei

[guangwei]

double post

Edited May 23, 2013 by guangwei

[Throttle]

Guangwei, it only works your way if the resource is abundant and the need is not a want.

in the case of a car and limited land in Singapore, it's not so simple.

however i agree, there are certainly better ways to handle the COE isuue as we have discussed over the years.

 

you are not wrong about the game.

even at work, it's survival of the fittest.

If i pay you $15k per mth and you produce always less than the other people whom i also pay $15k, (hypothetically all else equals) what do you think i will do as the Boss?

 

1. Cut your bonus

2. Cut your bonus

3. Cut your bonus

 

Therefore, it is a situation right here in Singapore.

 

The only stupid thing is the speed at which inflation has accelerated over the last 10yrs.

And it's clearly due to the higher numbers bringing higher demand.

too high number, too short time leads to a bottleneck.

we dont need scholars to tell us that. Worse still, they couldnt even forecast! Haha.

of course, without being one sided, Singaporeans gained as well when their assets increase in prices.

so there is a trade off and we need to balance our assessment of the situation

 

Bottomline, 100% affordable education, housing and public transport are three key elements for a successful nation. Whatever is private like non public housing, non public education and non public transport, is a contest of ability. That is meritocracy.

 

The best way in my opinion is still to fix the price of COE maybe at $30k and allow fluctuations according to inflation Or GDP. So everyone pays the same price in line with the general growth of the country.

 

couple this with full cash payment for COE and 50% down payment for vehicle price.

It will set a good baseline standard although, i dont think there lies a system without flaws.

 

at the end on the day, my only wish is that we as a nation grow for right reasons

 

 

all the best

[normad]

I believe we are partly to be blamed for the increasing prices of COE. The typical lifespan of a car in Singapore is/was 2-3 years where the depreciation graduals so car owners trade up or down, whatever it is, each time this happens, a NEED for COE is introduced in an individual and this propagates into the probability that he/she will be willing to pay that little "extra" to get the COE he/she needs to get that car.

 

Now just take a walk around licensed warehouses where cars are marked for export and you'll see what I mean. You see '11 458s, LP560s all lined up waiting to be exported.

 

But, with that said, this 'culture' is also due to the concept of COE pegging the lifespan of a car in SG for 10 years, directly affecting the value of the car so- back to square one.

[MR BIKER]

Long ago, a car's lifespan (exclude those involve in major accident) can go up to 30 years.(consider my Datsun 100A) without much problems.no issue of bad fc or dirty exhaust. for its almost 30 yrs life, it actually went almost 250k km Nowadays cars are equipped with so many gadgets and what not and thus more problems prompting owners to buy and sell 2 to 3 years later and let the next owner solve that problems.

THIS IS ABSOLUTELY NONSENSE. if you go many countries like Malaysia , Indonesia, old cars are using their old machine born in the 60s and 70 and modify them to suit the environment and FC.

Our government is just using our kiasu mentality to change whenever problems come and thus changing cars. COE should be charged more for people who this way.???

[Throttle]

Long ago, a car's lifespan (exclude those involve in major accident) can go up to 30 years.(consider my Datsun 100A) without much problems.no issue of bad fc or dirty exhaust. for its almost 30 yrs life, it actually went almost 250k km Nowadays cars are equipped with so many gadgets and what not and thus more problems prompting owners to buy and sell 2 to 3 years later and let the next owner solve that problems.

THIS IS ABSOLUTELY NONSENSE. if you go many countries like Malaysia , Indonesia, old cars are using their old machine born in the 60s and 70 and modify them to suit the environment and FC.

Our government is just using our kiasu mentality to change whenever problems come and thus changing cars. COE should be charged more for people who this way.???

 

 

Its all about materialism today

 

eg. You drive old car ? You drive secondhand car? Eeeeeeeeee....

eg. Aiyoh, you got a good job, how come you got no car.

[MR BIKER]

Hhahahahha. true, so true

[Jehuty]

Long ago, a car's lifespan (exclude those involve in major accident) can go up to 30 years.(consider my Datsun 100A) without much problems.no issue of bad fc or dirty exhaust. for its almost 30 yrs life, it actually went almost 250k km Nowadays cars are equipped with so many gadgets and what not and thus more problems prompting owners to buy and sell 2 to 3 years later and let the next owner solve that problems.

THIS IS ABSOLUTELY NONSENSE. if you go many countries like Malaysia , Indonesia, old cars are using their old machine born in the 60s and 70 and modify them to suit the environment and FC.

Our government is just using our kiasu mentality to change whenever problems come and thus changing cars. COE should be charged more for people who this way.???

 

Bro, that's where the LTA comes in, if its not stock, its illegal, thats why they have to change or they will have to deal with fines after fines. Considering you can find the original parts, if not, you'll have to use aftermarket.

 

All planned by the govt to skive you out of every single cent you have. Put COE so people change cars every so often, make COE damn high so they earn from it and control the number of cars as well, have LTA make everything that isn't stock illegal for spare change as well as make people sell or scrap old cars.

 

If we could only apply the COE logic to ministers.

[mechwira]

at the end of the day, if someone has a better idea of how to control the car population rather than COE, lets hear it. i dun like paying for that piece of paper with a price tag twice the price of the actual car i'm buying, but lets face it: we all want to buy car, but if we are all allowed to buy car, the road becomes unusable. whoever dun acknowledge the real problem of traffic congestion is just in denial.

 

the COE system limits the number of cars purchased, period. even if you point out that LTA miscalculate past few years and admit too may COE's released (thus causing current sky-high prices), be aware that essentially that is a calculation mistake, not a systemic flaw.

 

so what other method do we have? all i can think of is to peg COE to per household rather than by capacity. 'CAT A' is for a household's first car, 'CAT B' is for the household's second car. So even if husband and wife and one adult son/daughter (staying in the same housing unit) all got class 3, they either make do with one car for entire family, or bid utra-high 'CAT B' for a second or third car. after all what's the point of pegging the category to capacity? for car control, one family forced to use a single big capacity minivan better or two/three small cars better? penalize the households getting second and third cars, not the ones buying bigger cars.

 

but whatever method you think of, bear in mind this: any effective method you propose necessarily means that a significant portion of us will not be able to buy car, because that is the whole point of car population control. we cant all be getting cars because then the road is too congested. the only issue is can there be a method where only some of us get to buy cars without resorting to increasing the price of the cars.