Adding little 2T oil into fuel tank for 4-stroke bike and feel the smoothness

[icewater]

ChaoPuzzy1968 got a good point on the piston. But the rust in the tank wouldn't help by adding 2T, it is mostly kept rust free by the petrol. So if bike needs to keep for long time, remember to fill full tank. (btw your name is ..can change or not?)

 

Icewater got a clear picture on how 2 Stroke engine works, but I want to point out the below:

 

1) 2 stroke engine got better exhaust result then 4 stroke is that they do not have valves, 4 stroke comes with many valves, from 2 to 4 to now 5, may be 6 in the future, the problem with valves are tight fitting is required, a bit of carbon residue will give problems, 2 stroke just like fart..so **** in the exhaust hole also no big deal. So your statement on completely purged out should be think again.

2) Even 4 stroke engine is making 6000rpm, the exhaust only happen 6000/4= 1500times, not as frequent as you might think, and for burnt oil stay in the burst chamber for s

o long bad+bad...

3) No matter how small amount of 2T add into 4 stroke engine...only do more harm then good.

 

this is a good link to understand 2 stroke works, remember no oil sump for 2 stroke, due to the opening for exhaust and intake, note that 2 stroke exhaust so well that unburnt oil can be exhausted out.

 

http://science.howstuffworks.com/transport/engines-equipment/two-stroke.htm

 

Regarding 1, actually 4 strokes also have carbon build up as well. It is often seen above the valves and it is not unusual to see a layer when you use your finger to touch the exhaust pipe outlet. Of course adding 2T is probably adding even more carbon since it doesn't burn well, but having THAT little bit more might be negligible enough not to clog anything significantly faster. It is possible that these folks are having the smoothess they want without too significantly prematurely clogging up their engines.

 

Regarding 2, i was comparing inline4 configuration versus say a single cylinder or vtwin. Inline4 having 4 cylinders usually means each chamber is also smaller, presumely faster purging since there is less volume to purge and less residual time in the chamber? I was just thinking along that line.

 

Anyway, I think adding 2T is a hassle and it takes some devotion to do it right. It does risk clogging your engines but to say its a sure overhaul, i personally don't think so. You guys can have fun but really DON'T add too much. The more you add the higher the risk of overhaul, no one really knows the tipping point at the stage I guess.

[Isopropyl]

Wah, so happening here. Some ppl ride 4 stroke because of the hassle free of adding 2T to their bike. Now got ppl want the hassle back by adding back 2T. Funny thing ppl do.....

 

i agree. especially ridng bike with a 4L tank. every other day have to top up.

 

just go for V power and move on:)

[ChaoPuzzy1968]

wait to see the pic of the piston n valve

[Hydher]

Just realized that the significant decrease in Fuel consumption could be due to the air cleaner coming lose thus bike running leaner. Got it right now. Plugs change in 800km more (:

Wait for the updates.

[ezzyoiler]

try burning your ashless...high price 2t...

 

will it smoke??

[ezzyoiler]

can anyone adding 2t in gasoline with the reccommended 2t...spare a ml or so to do test??

my cheapo 2t cum chain oil smoke like hell..

[ooitn]

can anyone adding 2t in gasoline with the reccommended 2t...spare a ml or so to do test??

my cheapo 2t cum chain oil smoke like hell..

 

What do you mean?

Smoke when burning oil(not gasoline) is normal...just like you fry fish at home..a lot of smoke, but you never see Macdornal deep fry thier french fries with any smoke..

That the basic theory behind....

[byte77]

can anyone adding 2t in gasoline with the reccommended 2t...spare a ml or so to do test??

my cheapo 2t cum chain oil smoke like hell..

 

The fuel has to be in vapour form before ignited in the chamber.

To simulate this, can you vapourize the 2T oil first?

Edited October 28, 2011 by byte77

[ezzyoiler]

so you are saying ...

petrol in vapour form or liquid form burns differently? one with smoke and the other cleaner??

 

well..burning petrol in liquid form is still no smoke...

the 2t definietly produces smoke then...well need to go back to school to figure out..

 

please do a test..the ashless expensive 2t ...see how it behaves...

and see for your self..

 

someone ask..burning newspaper?/ the newspaper act as a catylyst for the oil to burn..you try burning pure oil with a flame and let me know how easy is this ..

Edited October 28, 2011 by ezzyoiler

[ezzyoiler]

What do you mean?

Smoke when burning oil(not gasoline) is normal...just like you fry fish at home..a lot of smoke, but you never see Macdornal deep fry thier french fries with any smoke..

That the basic theory behind....

 

frying chips/food ...you have oil mist ..oil being evaporated in the air..

the smoke you see if any is the moisture in the food..turning into smoke actually steam....

its a bad comparison...

 

during cooking..sometimes/purposely flames appear on the food...still a clean burn...

 

did a burning test with my cheapo cooking oil....

it burns faster than the cheapo 2t..but with lesser black smoke..

 

my conclusion is...without any statistica basis..just my common sense ..

 

volatile liquid burns faster and cleaner than non/lesser volatile liquid..

based on just a simple observation..

on the speed of burning..

can the smoking burning 2t can be ully burned during the power stroke..

the answer will be interesting..

Edited October 28, 2011 by ezzyoiler

[Orleng]

so you are saying ...

petrol in vapour form or liquid form burns differently? one with smoke and the other cleaner??

 

well..burning petrol in liquid form is still no smoke...

the 2t definietly produces smoke then...well need to go back to school to figure out..

 

please do a test..the ashless expensive 2t ...see how it behaves...

and see for your self..

 

someone ask..burning newspaper?/ the newspaper act as a catylyst for the oil to burn..you try burning pure oil with a flame and let me know how easy is this ..

 

frying chips/food ...you have oil mist ..oil being evaporated in the air..

the smoke you see if any is the moisture in the food..turning into smoke actually steam....

its a bad comparison...

 

during cooking..sometimes/purposely flames appear on the food...still a clean burn...

 

did a burning test with my cheapo cooking oil....

it burns faster than the cheapo 2t..but with lesser black smoke..

 

my conclusion is...without any statistica basis..just my common sense ..

 

volatile liquid burns faster and cleaner than non/lesser volatile liquid..

based on just a simple observation..

on the speed of burning..

can the smoking burning 2t can be ully burned during the power stroke..

the answer will be interesting..

 

 

How is burning 2T using a normal flame under non-compressed, non-atomised conditions the same as being in the engine?

 

Inside an engine, the temperatures + pressure reached after spark ignition are much higher than what you in your so-called pseudo-scientific can ever hope to achieve.

 

Go try burning the same oil at those temperatures/pressure/atomisation and see if it burns ashless. If cannot understand, then go back to school and study.

 

Maybe go mix ashless 2T at the recommended dose with petrol and do a side-by-side simultaneous atmospheric level burn, which isn't anywhere near the conditions as estimated. And guess what. I reiterate, in recommended LOW concentration. NOT the normal dosage required by 2-stroke engines.

 

You talk about bad comparisons? and your newspaper/2t puddle/petrol burning example isn't? please.....

 

Go try and burn the 2T with a heat source which reaches ~2200Kelvins, under the same compression pressure. That's the typical peak temperature. During the power stroke as you say.

 

Your tests don't matter. They are non-representative of actual operating conditions and cannot be extrapolated to show any similarities.

 

Nobody cares if newspaper burns faster than petrol which burns faster than 2T.

 

And yes, there will always be deposits. Even burning petrol will leave deposits. There are other impurities in petrol. so it will never burn "clean". Evidence is the soot in your exhaust, even in 4-strokes.

 

The question is, at high temperatures, can these byproducts be burnt into products which have minimal mass/impact and which can exit the exhaust system cleanly.

 

Again, if you add 2T at the same concentration as you would in a 2 stroke engine, of course it will results in a smoky burn.

 

What the bros here are suggesting are levels which are lower by order of 10x+ 640:1 instead of normally 50:1. Question is can the engine burn hot enough to result in ashless products.

 

AND again, for the record, I am not using 2T in my engine. I am here as I would like to see concrete proof of whether it causes damage or if there are benefits.

 

Some witchdoctor hocum of meaninglessly burning random objects and then using it as a "common sense" argument is anything but.

 

Edit : AND burning newspaper is NOT a catalyst. need to go back to school. And use a propane flame, ~2200K, and see how quick that expensive 2T turns into nothing. THAT will be more similar to peak temps in ICE.

Edited October 28, 2011 by Orleng

[ezzyoiler]

any one does that simple test??? burn the xxx 2t?

so dificult to do..i understand...it is easer to paste a wall of text.

[Orleng]

So difficult to read the wall of text? maybe have to go back to school.

It is easier to do irrelevant "experiments" not even close to actual state of combustion and create smoke screen.....i understand......

[ezzyoiler]

learn a nnew word today..

are you practicing it??

 

Plagiarism

 

 

Plagiarism is defined in dictionaries as the "wrongful appropriation," "close imitation," or "purloining and publication" of another author's "language, thoughts, ideas, or expressions," and the representation of them as one's own original work,^[1][2] but the notion remains problematic with nebulous boundaries.^[3][4][5][6] The modern concept of plagiarism as immoral and originality as an ideal emerged in Europe only in the 18th century, particularly with the Romantic movement, while in the previous centuries authors and artists were encouraged to "copy the masters as closely as possible" and avoid "unnecessary invention

 

 

and so on..

[Orleng]

learn a nnew word today..

are you practicing it??

 

Plagiarism

 

 

Plagiarism is defined in dictionaries as the "wrongful appropriation," "close imitation," or "purloining and publication" of another author's "language, thoughts, ideas, or expressions," and the representation of them as one's own original work,^[1][2] but the notion remains problematic with nebulous boundaries.^[3][4][5][6] The modern concept of plagiarism as immoral and originality as an ideal emerged in Europe only in the 18th century, particularly with the Romantic movement, while in the previous centuries authors and artists were encouraged to "copy the masters as closely as possible" and avoid "unnecessary invention

 

 

and so on..

 

Good for you that you learnt this new word today. I learnt it a long time ago.

 

Nice to also see that you are practicing it actively, by plagiarising that block of text.

 

Where are the citations [1][2][3][4][5][6]?

[ChaoPuzzy1968]

NPNT----no picture no talk......let see the piston n valve.....

[ezzyoiler]

pity those who has no originality....yeah keep on plagiarising..

now u know who does it..

[Orleng]

Oh, there's no need for self-pity. The one who plagarises other pages on their chain care by spamming a "wall of text" (oh wait, who was it who said that?"). And plagarised the idea to ban other users as well after what has been suggested done to them.

No need to point out to others what you have been doing.

[ezzyoiler]

haha.... haha

plagiarise..now u know who does it...

 

yeah i hate tail gaters do you?

[ezzyoiler]

very soon tail gaters will respond...see how

[Orleng]

Lol, yes, yes, keep up the plagiarism spiel, very original to keep repeating over and over.

 

oh wait, i forgot, quite original to come up with meaningless experiment with no DOE.

 

Say.....who was the one keep saying DOE is DOE. haha.

 

I don't hate. here SBF, all should love love one another. Who are the haters. We can all see....

[ezzyoiler]

.......................................ha ha

[ChaoPuzzy1968]

Lol, yes, yes, keep up the plagiarism spiel, very original to keep repeating over and over.

 

oh wait, i forgot, quite original to come up with meaningless experiment with no DOE.

 

Say.....who was the one keep saying DOE is DOE. haha.

 

I don't hate. here SBF, all should love love one another. Who are the haters. We can all see....

 

.......................................ha ha

 

sound like a couple i know quite sometime back.... they go married and have 3 kids....

 

so when are you 2 going to say yes and i do .....

[Limsteel]

You guys freaking bored? EO org a mass DIY chain oiler session, it will do lots of good for the rest of the rider.

 

Orleng, Riders who added 2T can continue to enjoy the smooth and increase milage ride. Let EO believe what he want, that 1 day our bike will have a major failure due to 2T.

 

I am a skeptic in the beginning, but webbies, forums (US, UK, Oz, Sg) have good reviews... of all the thread I read... only 1 user complaint of clogged injector after almost immediately adding it (can't find the URL). At 0.2% 2T:Petrol ratio, I seriously don't think it is not going to happen. Now after adding to my bike, I am adding 2T to my car too. yet to finish the first tankful of petrol. cant comment on the fuel economy... smoothness, my butt isn't that sensitive, I can feel it is a bit smoother but may be psycho effect...

[Hydher]

Here's my plugs after 5k of 2t usage.

Looks a little fouled to me on my rear vtwin cylinders. Top 2 are good.

My butt's dyno tells me there's a world of difference.

 

http://i239.photobucket.com/albums/ff37/hydher/IMG_2547.jpg

 

http://i239.photobucket.com/albums/ff37/hydher/IMG_2546.jpg

 

http://i239.photobucket.com/albums/ff37/hydher/IMG_2545.jpg

 

http://i239.photobucket.com/albums/ff37/hydher/IMG_2544.jpg

 

http://i239.photobucket.com/albums/ff37/hydher/IMG_2543.jpg