SHELL - OFFICIAL STATEMENT RELEASED

[Steppenwolf]

Originally posted by MPeX@Mar 12 2005, 01:59 AM

Conclusion

 

We have, throughout the 2 hour meeting, drilled across our point to Shell that the customer should be allowed their own choices. The choices are

 

1) To dismount or not to dismount - riders be liable for their own vehicles and safety.

 

2) Shell vs. another petrol company down the road.

 

Why allow (2) to happen when (1) will easily solve the entire issue?

 

Are u saying that they'll leave the choice to us about stradling our bikes, or that they are still mulling over it?

[MPeX]

Originally posted by jockster@Mar 21 2005, 02:22 PM

Are u saying that they'll leave the choice to us about stradling our bikes, or that they are still mulling over it?

The policy will stand, we will still have to dismount.

 

They're mulling over the way they're going to enforce this tactfully instead of the iron-handed manner which is happening now..

[william_liu]

So long as this ruling doesn't become law, I'm still not worried.....

 

But if it does..... I shudder to think that the day may come when we will have to don full protective leather suits, proper riding boots and full-faces before they'll let us on the road.

 

If you're thinking: "Aiyah no one will be so stupid to suggest this kind of law one lah", then you'll be mistaken, cos there was a case back in the late 1980s in Britain regarding the compulsory "leg-protectors" to be installed on bikes. The result?

 

25,000 bikers turned up for a mass rally, various motorcycling associations opposed it and in the end the idea was was dropped, and the Transport Minister (who suggested it) left office not so long after.....

 

More on bikers' rights here and here (No, we're not the only "whiny" and "paranoid" ones eh )

[MPeX]

SHELL REPLIES

 

Hi ---,

 

We thank you for the opportunity to listen to and learn from the views expressed by the biking community arising from our safety advice requiring riders to dismount from their bikes before and to stay dismounted during refueling. We are heartened that you share a common understanding of and agree with us concerning the risk of petrol spillage when bikers stay mounted during refueling and the potential danger of a fire outbreak should the spilled petrol comes into contact with hot engine/exhaust parts.

 

Shell regards safety as one of its highest priorities and constantly strive to raise safety standards to even higher levels for our staff and customers alike. We aim for zero-tolerance for mishaps at Shell petrol stations, and for this, we seek the full co-operation of all stakeholders - staff, station operators and customers. To this end, we have launched the nationwide safety awareness drive to promote safe refueling practices at petrol service stations. Dismounting from the motorbike during refueling is one of the key safety measures advocated in this campaign.

 

We are grateful to you for highlighting to us the service lapse at the station level, which may have been the result of the staff's eagerness to adopt the new initiative but, nonetheless, borne out of good intentions. We apologise for any breakdown in the communication chain with our operators and site staff, and we assure you that it is never our intention to embarass any of our customers. We have already sent an immediate circular to our network to coach the site staff on the finer points of customer engagement and the rationale behind this particular initiative, and will reinforce this message at the monthly face-to-face engagement meetings .

 

We would like to reassure the biking community that this initiative is not to discriminate against bikers. We would like to emphasize that the risk we are seeking to address is the potential spillage onto the hot engine/exhaust parts located immediately below the bike's fuel tank that could potentially ignite any spilled petrol. Cars, on the other hand, are not exposed to the same danger. Also as car engines are required to be switched off when refueling, we have noticed that most customers actually do not stay in the car as their car air-con would similarly be turned off.

 

We understand that one of the complaints is that it is not easy to refuel the bike to the brim when dismounted and put on side stand, not to mention the greater risk entailed when the biker tries to straighten the bike and refuel at the same time. Within resource limitations and upon a request by the biker, we will be advising the site staff to assist in refueling the bike so long as they are not required to hold the bike upright as our staff may not have the necessary experience in handling the various makes of bikes.

 

We thank you for the constructive suggestions of allowing a grace period for the biking community to adapt to the new initiative. To manage this change and convince bikers of the risks involved, we are pleased to inform you that we will allow for a grace period till 31st Mar 05 before fully implementing the no-sales policy on bikers who refuse to dismount before refueling. Till then, we will advise our site staff to actively persuade bikers to dismount while refueling and create the awareness for those who may not be familiar with the English safety leaflet (Think Safe Stay Safe) that are already available at all Shell stations.

 

We hope that the above measures can reassure the biking community of Shell's good intentions and would like to take this opportunity to thank the biking community for their continued support and for making Shell their preferred brand of petrol.

 

 

 

Redgs,

Derrick Ong

Operations Support Manager

Shell Eastern Petroleum (Pte) Ltd

31 Pandan Road, Singapore 609278

 

Tel: +65-6263 2822 Fax: 2819

Email: [email protected]

Internet: http://www.shell.com

[-PeNsKe-]

:nono: Malaysia's shell boleh...

[promal]

But seriously.. petrol spilling on engines/exhaust really cause explosions? are these parts really that hot?

 

I'm not so sure about this, anyone can confirm?

[william_liu]

If you spill the petrol onto your hot engine, yes, of course there is a possibility.

 

Just like there's a possibility some psycho will suddenly walk up beside you and lit a match while you're refueling. (Hey you'll never know, look at the American criminal who killed the judge then escaped)

 

Just like the possibility lightning strikes when you're playing soccer on a football fields. (S-League China guy, anyone?)

 

Just like the possibility that tomorrow when any of us ride to work and something bad happens..... (Just look in the papers, almost every week got news...)

 

 

Anyway now it's Esso/Mobil boleh!

[Speedpass]

i spilled some petrol on the hot body of my 04R1 (which is known for its hotness) , but here i m , still posting in tis forum .

 

the petrol has overflowed from my tank n flowed from the tank to the super heated frame n the left side of the engine .

[mechwira]

When the temperature of a liquid is just high enough for it to evaporate in sufficient quantities to ignite if a spark or flame is applied, we say it has reached its flashpoint. Diesel has a flashpoint of 61° whereas petrol is below 0° Celsius. A bucket of diesel fuel would extinguish a lighted match that was dropped into it, but the same exercise with a bucket of petrol would produce a rather more spectacular result.

 

Note that the flashpoint is not the temperature at which a material bursts into flame by itself. That is called auto-ignition temperature, and even for a liquid like petrol, may be over 400°C. For a liquid to flash we have to supply something to ignite it.

 

vehicles dont explode (unless you're in hollywood); but they do catch fire.

[ah_tee]

i think sua lor i think they still bery sturbborn

 

funniest thing i heard is most passengers do not remain in cars during refueling

 

lol

[william_liu]

"MOST customers actually do not stay in the car ....."

 

 

Yah! Then we should ask them what happen to their "zero-tolerance for mishaps" policy......

 

Or maybe we can also say "MOST bikers will NOT spill petrol while refueling, sitted or standing".......

 

HO HO HO!

[danieltanboonhuat]

hmm.... still not as good as I hoped... i thought they will help us hold the bike upright...

 

 

It's msia for me from now on

[Enotsol]

They told us that their pump attendants are good with the pump trigger.. i wonder how good they are when they dun even have to hold the trigger when pumping for cars....

 

On to Mobil

[Easyrider_Bandit]

SPC and Petronas for me!

 

[XtremeZ]

the reply they gave really dun convince me about their safety policy

[Arcfire]

Hmmm...how abt they provide paddock stand for bikers den?

[william_liu]

Just thought of something:

 

If they're SO concerned about spillage, why not provide bikes with a special type of petrol FUNNEL device so that chances of spillage will be reduced to ZERO, no matter if I'm standing/sitting/lying down while refueling.

 

It can't be THAT hard or expensive to engineer and implement such a device right? Of course it'll cost SOME money to implement, but since they're aiming for "zero-tolerance" and "safety first" then surely this is a justifiable cost, isn't it?

 

Unless all this "SAFETY" talk is just for PR/show only..... then of course a "no-sales policy on bikers who refuse to dismount before refueling" is by far easier and cheaper to implement......

 

And do you realise their policy of dismounting DOES NOT address how to PREVENT the "spillage problem" (which they seem to think happens very often) from happening in the first place?

[299]

oh...it's finally over.

[kalai_33]

this shell thing is real crazy thing, why not we jam up one of da shell one day , maybe about 100 bike, dismount da bike , take your time pump , make sure nothing spills ...of all must really sure that car drivers must complian to shell that bikers are delying in refulling......mmmmmmmmm maybe sound stupid.......but mass refulling of bike will be my idea to get back at them......1 bike take about 5mins to top up, imagine 10 in one pump.........great.

[MPeX]

With their reply, I'm calling it a day as far as this issue is concerned...

 

Any1 who still has a bone to pick with Shell can personally email/call them at the address/number given after the signature on the reply...

 

[Keynes]

Originally posted by promal@Mar 21 2005, 09:49 PM

But seriously.. petrol spilling on engines/exhaust really cause explosions? are these parts really that hot?

 

I'm not so sure about this, anyone can confirm?

To cause an fire, in the case of bike's at petrol station, we need:-

 

 

EITHER:-

 

1) atomised petrol (meaning petrol which has gone through the carburattor, or fuel injector) in contact with vey hot parts.

 

OR

 

2) liquid petrol in contact with a flame or spark (in this case like a match, or very static electricity).

 

That's y liquid petrol in contact with hot engine parts casue no fire.

[Keynes]

Originally posted by william_liu@Mar 21 2005, 07:17 PM

If you're thinking: "Aiyah no one will be so stupid to suggest this kind of law one lah", then you'll be mistaken, cos there was a case back in the late 1980s in Britain regarding the compulsory "leg-protectors" to be installed on bikes. The result?

 

25,000 bikers turned up for a mass rally, various motorcycling associations opposed it and in the end the idea was was dropped, and the Transport Minister (who suggested it) left office not so long after.....

 

More on bikers' rights here and here (No, we're not the only "whiny" and "paranoid" ones eh )

Tt's y we need MAS, not Malaysia Ada System, nor Malaysia Airlines but MOTORCYCLES ASSOCIATION of SINGAPORE. There are active discussions at the Rally Point Thread there.

[Guest limpeiwah]

SPC i dont really like their fuel. As for shell they can jolly well go and f!@# themselves for this high handed authoritative stance.

[william_liu]

To sum it up, their position in the end will be:

 

"..fully implementing the no-sales policy on bikers who refuse to dismount before refueling."

 

So guys and gals, since they have stated CLEARLY that they do not wish to do the business of riders who refuel while sitting and straddling, I'm sure the answer for the rest of us who do that is clear also. At least for me it's very clear.

 

I'm signing off this matter as well now! Once again kudos to MPeX and those who went to meet up with them.

[Steppenwolf]

So, just to be clear... any other petrol stations besides shell is doing this? So far, i've switched to esso, and no issues...