Rear Brake Locked during Hard Braking

[Raptor]

  endlessloop said:

Some people think that using the engine braking is a good way to slow the bike down and will not lock up the rear wheel.

 

Just beware that applying engine braking to slow down the rear wheel really has the same effect as using the rear foot brake to slown down the rear wheel. Go figure.

 

So, it is possible to cause the rear wheel to lock by dropping gears. Some bikes are more prone to this than some others.

 

For normal slowing down community riding, using engine braking is fine.

But for sudden hard emergency braking, it's better to use front brakes and if necessary, rear foot brake. Only when the bike has slowed down somewhat, then it is safe to drop gear to utlise engine braking.

 

Some bikes are equipped with slipper clutches. It is impossible for them to lock up during downshifts.

[mab]

During e-brake, jam both heels into the tarmac and stop ur bike with ur feet and leg strength(bicycle style)

[Dafanshu]

rainy day slow down better. late better than never.

[ulysses_sc]

  endlessloop said:

Some people think that using the engine braking is a good way to slow the bike down and will not lock up the rear wheel.

 

Just beware that applying engine braking to slow down the rear wheel really has the same effect as using the rear foot brake to slown down the rear wheel. Go figure.

 

So, it is possible to cause the rear wheel to lock by dropping gears. Some bikes are more prone to this than some others.

 

For normal slowing down community riding, using engine braking is fine.

But for sudden hard emergency braking, it's better to use front brakes and if necessary, rear foot brake. Only when the bike has slowed down somewhat, then it is safe to drop gear to utlise engine braking.

 

I tend to have a different opinion. Rear wheel lock caused by engine braking usually occurs if the rider drops a few gears from very high rpm quickly.

 

At the track, I experience slight rear wheel chatter when dropping from gear 4 to gear 2 while the engine is reving at about 7 to 8,000 rpms, and I mis-time blipping the throttle. Other than that, it's usually pretty ok.

 

On the roads, this means that engine brake induced wheel lock is pretty rare, unless the rider drops to gear 1 while travelling at 120km/h. Anyways during e-braking situations, I don't think there is enough time even attempting to use engine braking.

[Forgestryker]

Wow i learn so much from reading this thread...i didn't know rear breaking is so dangerous..i am just a new rider and i always like to use my rear as it is smoother. Sometimes i just use rear all the way and only apply front brake when it almost stop.

 

Scary...looks like i need to retrain and use front brake much much more. School got say 70% front 30% back meh? I cant remember leh...opps. Hahahaa

[CSV]

a rear wheel lock was what caused me to skid when i jammed on it out of instinct.

 

so if you wanna brake well, remember the 70/30 rule. 70 front/30 rear. and if in the rain, 90/10.

 

regardless, brake gently if possible. don't wanna get a stoppie either.

[Jehuty]

Rarely do I use my rear brake, always the front, had the front wheel locked once, it was also the first time I skidded and before I know it, I was sliding on tarmac, the bike was under a truck. Wasn't pretty, happened all very quickly.

[ben1112]

I think the best way to find out is to get out there on a rainy day, find a safe empty space and practise e-brake. You can say what 70/30 90/10, but each bike are built differently and reacts differently. Practise locking your rear brakes for time to time to remind yourself of the threshold. Voila! Next best thing to ABS.

[CSV]

yeap. practice locking your rear so you know how hard NOT to step on the brakes.

 

i did in on public road (late in the night la) and practice awhile. step rear brake until screeching heard then release. 50km/h should be more than enough to find out. progressively increase the brake strength instead of whacking the brake in one shot.

[Forgestryker]

Good advice! I will try in a safe way, must remember to use front brakes much more. Thanks peeps!

[kinwei]

I never use my rear brake at all. 3 digit speed or 2 digit speed, front brake is all I need to slow down. But the bikes I ride are front heavy aka sport bikes.

[Hydher]

adjust the biting point of your brake pedal to be further.

[mild_slevin]

condition of ur tires play some part as well.

[vyruz]

  ulysses_sc said:

Most bikes do not come with ABS or CBS or whatever braking aids. When braking on such bikes, I normally employ only the front binders, just like on track.

 

During hard braking, most weight is transferred to the front, and the rear becomes very light. All it takes is for a light tapping on the rear brake pedal to cause a lock up.

 

  kinwei said:

I never use my rear brake at all. 3 digit speed or 2 digit speed, front brake is all I need to slow down. But the bikes I ride are front heavy aka sport bikes.

 

I'm with these guys. Front stoppers are all I need and use.

 

I have no doubt that rear brakes can help slow you down - I suppose that's why we're taught to use it in an e-brake situation in school - but in real life situations, the potential pitfalls of using the rear brake for me outweigh the benefits.

[crazydj]

Ever since my 2 front wheel locks resulting in buangs, i moved from 80% front, 20% rear braking to 60% front and 40% rear braking.

 

I've always felt its better to lock your rear wheel that to lock your front wheel. I've locked my rear wheel many times before, but the 2 times my bike's front wheel locked, both resulted in skids.

 

And don't give me "It's the rider, not the bike" bullshi+.

 

Oh one more thing. If your brake hoses are those aftermarket stainless steel ones, they MAY be too overpowered for your bike. I made the wrong decision to get an aftermarket SS brake hose. Now its WAY too powerful. The front wheel can lock just by squeezing a little bit.

[xXxRatedxXx]

  crazydj said:

Ever since my 2 front wheel locks resulting in buangs, i moved from 80% front, 20% rear braking to 60% front and 40% rear braking.

 

I've always felt its better to lock your rear wheel that to lock your front wheel. I've locked my rear wheel many times before, but the 2 times my bike's front wheel locked, both resulted in skids.

 

And don't give me "It's the rider, not the bike" bullshi+.

 

Oh one more thing. If your brake hoses are those aftermarket stainless steel ones, they MAY be too overpowered for your bike. I made the wrong decision to get an aftermarket SS brake hose. Now its WAY too powerful. The front wheel can lock just by squeezing a little bit.

 

Dude.... its the rider.... not the bike.... i have SS brake hoses on both F and R... LOLS!!!

[Forgestryker]

  vyruz said:

I'm with these guys. Front stoppers are all I need and use.

 

I have no doubt that rear brakes can help slow you down - I suppose that's why we're taught to use it in an e-brake situation in school - but in real life situations, the potential pitfalls of using the rear brake for me outweigh the benefits.

 

 

Won't you highside if you do that?

[Fried Rice]

i brake by instinct. but front is more than back though

[CyBerKnighT]

Hahaha... If scared wheel lock again, just remove your rear caliper...

[vyruz]

  Forgestryker said:

Won't you highside if you do that?

 

Highsiding is unconnected with the front brakes. If anything, use of the rear brakes can cause a highside (see: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Highsider)

 

Do you mean will I go over the handlebars like a stoppie gone bad? There is a risk of this but only if you grab the front brakes as hard as you can and as fast as you can with zero sense of control. For me personally, I can feel the front brake lever better than I can feel the rear brake lever (I wear a race boot whenever I ride) so there is a much better chance of me being able to exert a controllable amount of pressure on the front brake lever than the rear.

 

I concede that a front wheel lockout is almost impossible to save, but the risk of this happening for me seems a lot lower than locking out the rear. I routinely lock out the rear on purpose in my MSCP and I know for a fact how easy it is to lock the rear out. I can only imagine how much easier it would be to lock the rear if I'm braking with front and rear brakes while negotiating a corner. There'd be almost no weight on the rear wheel and I'd be asking the rear wheel to get me around the corner and brake at the same time. It won't end well.

[Jehuty]

Don't use rear brakes when cornering, engine braking and front only. Besides it feels akward to use the rear breaks when cornering.

[crazydj]

  xXxRatedxXx said:

Dude.... its the rider.... not the bike.... i have SS brake hoses on both F and R... LOLS!!!

 

Do you ride MY bike? No right? So you wouldn't know. Every bike is different. Every bike may come out the same from the factory. What it is today, is the result of its past.

 

Same like you. Imagine if you were born in Singapore. Same hospital. Everything same. But at the age of 1 years, you moved to war torn Somalia. Will you be the same person you are today? I think not.

 

Gosh i even capitalised the word MAY. You and arthur_chan the same. Anyhow reply post just to clock post without even reading the posts. Haha.

[crazydj]

  Fried Rice said:

i brake by instinct. but front is more than back though

 

What if the braking is not the same? Like when i brake today, the brakes are stronger. I brake tomorrow, less strong. In the morning, its stiff. In the afternoon, its spongy.

 

Only my rear drum brakes are consistent. My front brakes before i changed to SS brake hose was consistent. Sigh.

[xXxRatedxXx]

  crazydj said:

Do you ride MY bike? No right? So you wouldn't know. Every bike is different. Every bike may come out the same from the factory. What it is today, is the result of its past.

 

Same like you. Imagine if you were born in Singapore. Same hospital. Everything same. But at the age of 1 years, you moved to war torn Somalia. Will you be the same person you are today? I think not.

 

Gosh i even capitalised the word MAY. You and arthur_chan the same. Anyhow reply post just to clock post without even reading the posts. Haha.

 

I ride before your bike leh........ never lock wheel before....

[Guest IceLkipz]

  xcel said:

I just serviced my rear brake recently (disc type) and the gripping became too effective during raining days. I encountered several occasions when I applied the rear brake hard, it would be locked and causing my rear tire skid left and right Thank GOD no car beside and I managed to slow down.

 

Any idea how to solve this problem?

 

1) Apply front brake harder than rear brake?

2) Use engine brake? (It's quite unlikely during emergency brake though)

3) Buy a machine with ABS braking system?

 

Brother,theres no such thing as wheel lock in rainy days only. however, it does happens to any type of days also. how to prevent it from happening again is to go another shop and ask them them lubricate the brake piston. it is due to the fact that the brake piston is unable to retract back tat u are having this problem.